Joint tenant refuse to move out after they give notice to terminate contract

ziaja

Situation:
I and 1 other tenant signed a joint tenancy with a land lord (LL) through a letting agent (LA)
We have stayed in this tenancy for 2 years, the tenancy has 6 month fix contract and then monthly rolling contract. So we are not having fix term contract restriction now.

My flat mate give notice to terminate the joint tenancy and told me and the LA that she would move out by 15 August 2018.
I contacted agent and told them I would want to stay and pay full rent by myself. LA agreed, as my salary is enough to cover the whole flat. I then signed a renewal contract with LA that does not contain my flat mate's name. The contract is still a rolling monthly contract, so I am not committed to any fixed term renting period.
On the 15 Aug, I paid back my flat mate all her security deposit that she contributed at the start of the tenancy from my own pocket.
However, now at 18 Aug, my flat mate refused to move out, and refuse to pay rent & utilities bill, she told me she will moved out next week, but it seem like she does not have intention to do so.
Could you please give me some advice about, what would be my option here? Is that the LL's responsibility to evict her, or is that my responsibility to sue her?

G_M

Legally an interesting scenario.

The first issue to confirm is whether the notice to quit was valid. Certainly it only takes one joint tenant to end a periodic tenancy for both - but was the notice served properly?

1) What date was it served?
2) What date did it expire? (15th August?)
3) was the tenancy a Statutory Periodic or Contractual Periodic? (read the tenancy agreement)
4) if Contractual, what notice period does the tenancy agreement state is required?
5) how was it served?
6) was it formally accepted by the landlord, and how?

Assuming the notice was valid, then on 15th August the tenancy ended. The occupants (both) became trespassers.

7) the landlord can seek a court order to evict trespassers. No S21 or S8 is required.
8) The landlord can charge a fee (mesne profit) = to double rent
Distress For Rent Act 1737 S18 (Double rent if tenant stays after giving notice) explanation

9) an alternative interpretation might be that when the tenancy ended on 15th August, the new tenancy commenced and you became the sole tenant (as intended). The 'joint tenant' is thus trespassing on your tenancy. He's not paying you rent so is not a lodger. That being so I believe you could simply physically evict him eg by changing the locks while he is out, bagging up his belongings, and then arranging for him to collect them (not letting him in obviously).

I'd be interested in other posters' views on 9) above!

tom9980

G_M wrote: »

Legally an interesting scenario.

The first issue to confirm is whether the notice to quit was valid. Certainly it only takes one joint tenant to end a periodic tenancy for both - but was the notice served properly?

1) What date was it served?
2) What date did it expire? (15th August?)
3) was the tenancy a Statutory Periodic or Contractual Periodic? (read the tenancy agreement)
4) if Contractual, what notice period does the tenancy agreement state is required?
5) how was it served?
6) was it formally accepted by the landlord, and how?

Assuming the notice was valid, then on 15th August the tenancy ended. The occupants (both) became trespassers.

7) the landlord can seek a court order to evict trespassers. No S21 or S8 is required.
8) The landlord can charge a fee (mesne profit) = to double rent
Distress For Rent Act 1737 S18 (Double rent if tenant stays after giving notice) explanation

9) an alternative interpretation might be that when the tenancy ended on 15th August, the new tenancy commenced and you became the sole tenant (as intended). The 'joint tenant' is thus trespassing on your tenancy. He's not paying you rent so is not a lodger. That being so I believe you could simply physically evict him eg by changing the locks while he is out, bagging up his belongings, and then arranging for him to collect them (not letting him in obviously).

I'd be interested in other posters' views on 9) above!

Tricky.

Doubt a judge would be happy with the tenant who gave notice then stayed if they tried to claim unlawful eviction in scenario 9 IF the remaining tenant changed the locks.

mrginge

ziaja wrote: »

Situation:

Could you please give me some advice about, what would be my option here? Is that the LL's responsibility to evict her, or is that my responsibility to sue her?

I vote for change the locks.

A. The LL is not going to do anything
B. The ‘guest’ is not going to pay anything

G_M

mrginge wrote: »

I vote for change the locks.

A. The LL is not going to do anything
B. The ‘guest’ is not going to pay anything

The risk is that
C. The 'guest' might scream illegal eviction from his AST

mrginge

G_M wrote: »

The risk is that
C. The 'guest' might scream illegal eviction from his AST

Then it becomes the LL’s problem

custardy

mrginge wrote: »

Then it becomes the LL’s problem

Totally agree.
Other party is living rent/bills free and in no hurry to move.
OP needs to take that comfort away.

ziaja

1) What date was it served?
It was served on 15 of July, by email to LA, who confirm received the email and agreed.
Their action of drafting a new contract for the remaining tenant also mean they received the
notification from the flat mate and agreed to it

2) What date did it expire? (15th August?)
The notice is served on 15 July for the move out date of 15 Aug.

3) was the tenancy a Statutory Periodic or Contractual Periodic? (read the tenancy agreement)
It was contractual Periodic

4) if Contractual, what notice period does the tenancy agreement state is required?
Tenancy agreement explicitly states it require 1 month notice

5) how was it served?
It was served by an email sent to LA, who confirmed that they received the email and agreed to terminate contract

6) was it formally accepted by the landlord, and how?
It was accepted by agent by email. No contact is made with Land Lord

Assuming the notice was valid, then on 15th August the tenancy ended. The occupants (both) became trespassers.
This would be right, but I have signed a new contract with my name on it to continue the
tenancy, but does my flat mate considered trespassers? what if LL refuse to take any action
and told me that this is my personal's business?

7) the landlord can seek a court order to evict trespassers. No S21 or S8 is required.
8) The landlord can charge a fee (mesne profit) = to double rent
Distress For Rent Act 1737 S18 (Double rent if tenant stays after giving notice) explanation.
Thank you for your information, but this is LL's option, but what would be my option to recover my loss, I now having to live in a share flat while paying the full rent of the whole flat. The LL is also taking full rent from me so he get no incentive of taking any action.

9) an alternative interpretation might be that when the tenancy ended on 15th August, the new tenancy commenced and you became the sole tenant (as intended). The 'joint tenant' is thus trespassing on your tenancy. He's not paying you rent so is not a lodger. That being so I believe you could simply physically evict him eg by changing the locks while he is out, bagging up his belongings, and then arranging for him to collect them (not letting him in obviously).
Thank you for advising, is this something I can do? because 1st: I am just tenant not LL so how can I have the right to change locks. 2nd As I aware, even the LL does not have the right to forcefully evict tenant after end of tenancy without court order (which take time). I think the LL also not have the right to just through tenant's belonging away right after tenancy end either. Have this interpretation is agreed by judge in any case law before. I.e have a judge ever deem an over stay tenant as trespasser?

custardy

ziaja wrote: »

1) What date was it served?
It was served on 15 of July, by email to LA, who confirm received the email and agreed.
Their action of drafting a new contract for the remaining tenant also mean they received the
notification from the flat mate and agreed to it

2) What date did it expire? (15th August?)
The notice is served on 15 July for the move out date of 15 Aug.

3) was the tenancy a Statutory Periodic or Contractual Periodic? (read the tenancy agreement)
It was contractual Periodic

4) if Contractual, what notice period does the tenancy agreement state is required?
Tenancy agreement explicitly states it require 1 month notice

5) how was it served?
It was served by an email sent to LA, who confirmed that they received the email and agreed to terminate contract

6) was it formally accepted by the landlord, and how?
It was accepted by agent by email. No contact is made with Land Lord

Assuming the notice was valid, then on 15th August the tenancy ended. The occupants (both) became trespassers.
This would be right, but I have signed a new contract with my name on it to continue the
tenancy, but does my flat mate considered trespassers? what if LL refuse to take any action
and told me that this is my personal's business?

7) the landlord can seek a court order to evict trespassers. No S21 or S8 is required.
8) The landlord can charge a fee (mesne profit) = to double rent
Distress For Rent Act 1737 S18 (Double rent if tenant stays after giving notice) explanation.
Thank you for your information, but this is LL's option, but what would be my option to recover my loss, I now having to live in a share flat while paying the full rent of the whole flat. The LL is also taking full rent from me so he get no incentive of taking any action.

9) an alternative interpretation might be that when the tenancy ended on 15th August, the new tenancy commenced and you became the sole tenant (as intended). The 'joint tenant' is thus trespassing on your tenancy. He's not paying you rent so is not a lodger. That being so I believe you could simply physically evict him eg by changing the locks while he is out, bagging up his belongings, and then arranging for him to collect them (not letting him in obviously).
Thank you for advising, is this something I can do? because 1st: I am just tenant not LL so how can I have the right to change locks. 2nd As I aware, even the LL does not have the right to forcefully evict tenant after end of tenancy without court order (which take time). I think the LL also not have the right to just through tenant's belonging away right after tenancy end either. Have this interpretation is agreed by judge in any case law before. I.e have a judge ever deem an over stay tenant as trespasser?

you change the locks & retain the landlords old locks for moving out.
Its good practice to change the locks on a rental as who knows who had keys and how many previously.
When I rented and moved a lot,I just swapped the yale type lock at moving in and swapped back when moving out.

HampshireH

Have you spoken to your friend and asked whats going on?

The deposit should have been released from the deposit scheme and your deposit put in again as a new set up.

I'm surprised the agent released the deposit before having confirmation they had left.

ziaja

HampshireH wrote: »

Have you spoken to your friend and asked whats going on?

The deposit should have been released from the deposit scheme and your deposit put in again as a new set up.

I'm surprised the agent released the deposit before having confirmation they had left.

Thank you for your comments:
My flat mate not giving me any information about what is going on, she said she is trying to find an other flat, but it clear for me that she is not doing that and intend to stay for rent free.

I talk to Letting Agent (LA) about the deposit. They said, as I continue with the rent, they will not change the details of the security deposit (which in both tenants name), they will not carry out inventory check or cleaning until I also end my tenancy. That why I paid my flat mate her full contribution to the tenancy deposit scheme because her deposit is still hold in scheme until I move out.
Plus the deposit will not be enough to cover the rent if she continue to stay in the long term. Plus I am still having to pay full rent, so there would be no reason to deduct the deposit.