Anauthorised Debit - Possible Fraud

JELL_2

I need help from anybody familiar with banking practices

A couple of days ago my son attempted to buy an annual season ticket at a railway station.
The ticket clerk told him that due to a problem with his card machine he would have to input the details manually.

He then rang to try for an authorisation code but said that he was unable to do so.

My son left the station and later that day went to another station to purchase his ticket. This time the transaction was refused because he had insufficient funds in his account.

He spoke to his bank who confirmed that the first clerk had been given an authorisation code twice and had attempted to debit my son's account 9 times.

He has reported this to the police who ,not surprisingly, are not interested

He has spoken to the station manger who has "promised an investigation"

The railway company say that it could take up to 10 days to return the money to his account

His bank claim that they are unable to refund the money until they receive authorisation from the railway's bank.

As this is an unauthorised deduction, my son did not sign anything or use his pin number, is his bank correct or are they obliged to do more.

Thanks

MarcoM

JELL wrote: »

I need help from anybody familiar with banking practices

A couple of days ago my son attempted to buy an annual season ticket at a railway station.
The ticket clerk told him that due to a problem with his card machine he would have to input the details manually.

He then rang to try for an authorisation code but said that he was unable to do so.

My son left the station and later that day went to another station to purchase his ticket. This time the transaction was refused because he had insufficient funds in his account.

He spoke to his bank who confirmed that the first clerk had been given an authorisation code twice and had attempted to debit my son's account 9 times.

He has reported this to the police who ,not surprisingly, are not interested

He has spoken to the station manger who has "promised an investigation"

The railway company say that it could take up to 10 days to return the money to his account

His bank claim that they are unable to refund the money until they receive authorisation from the railway's bank.

As this is an unauthorised deduction, my son did not sign anything or use his pin number, is his bank correct or are they obliged to do more.

Thanks

Which bank does your son bank with.

JELL_2

Allliance & Liecester, altho' I guess they're all much the same

arnie&caseysma!

The bank usually deal with these things themselvesa after unauthorised transaction are reported, refunding the money to the account holder and then dealing with it through their own fraud department.

Your son should ensure that there is a stop put on that card so that they can't try any further payments and request a new card from the bank.

The Police will be interested but banks usually deal with it themselves and your son was probably advised to speak with the bank first to see what action the bank themselves are taking as it involves many many forms and permissions to access bank details so that the police can get any involvement with the account and the bank whatsoever.

Biggles

This is what happens when there are failed debit card transactions, it's perfectly normal.

The transaction 'earmarks' the funds against the bank account but doesn't go through. A second failed attempt does the same thing.

Then, when you try again later, you are told you have no available funds. This is because one or more failed transactions are still 'earmarked' and using up all your 'available balance', though not deducted from your statement. These will fall off the account after a couple of days.

The police certainly wouldn't have been interested (they don't even take reports of real card fraud these days, you just report it to the bank).

As he's told the bank, he's done all he can till they fall off the account. It's annoying, and there's no way of knowing now what the original clerk did wrong, but the last thing he wants now is to get the card stopped as all it will do is waste a week or two before he has a usable debit card again. He's told the bank, if they thought it advisable to stop the card, they'd have told him so.

Mikeyorks

Previous post (#5) contains most of the detail. Except that 'reserved' amounts - where the transaction never materialises - can take up to 10 days to 'evaporate'.

You normally get this with hotels - where they swipe you card on arrival - obviously put a value on this ...... but then fail to clear that transaction when you leave.

The Merchant Acquirer acting for the railway (who the clerk rang for the code) - can put a £zero value through to free up the reserved funds. It's the only way you will clear it quickly - your son's Bank can't do anything.


Incidentally .... it's not fraud or even attempted fraud - with that sort of audit trail? Just a railway clerk with a duff terminal.

natweststaffmember

I was going to say the same as post 5 although I think the normal timescale to drop off the account is 3 working days which is the time that the company have to claim any funds that they have been given an authorisation code for. It may be different with other banks as I am as the name suggests working for natwest.

Mikeyorks

natweststaffmember wrote: »

... I think the normal timescale to drop off the account is 3 working days which is the time that the company have to claim any funds that they have been given an authorisation code for

...... yes, but the point here is that they're not claiming it. So the 'reserved amount' is in limbo ..... and can take up to 7 working days (i.e. the '10 {elapsed} days' in the OP) before the Bank systems default the reserve from it. And I doubt NatWest would cut that down to 3 days for unclaimed cases!

Biggles

Hotels may have a different arrangement, to allow for length of stay and finding any amount still owing after the guest has left.

Normally, I've found unclaimed amounts drop off in two or three days.

Iamthesmartestmanalive

Contact the train company

They can contact their merchant bank and arrange for the "reservations" to be cancelled off

They just cant be bothered

Also depending on your bank they may also be able to remove them under the understanding that if the company does send for payment you will go over the limit and be subject to the normal procedures for disputed/fraudulent transactions and any legitimate charges once those are complete

Your best option is to kick up a fuss with the train company and demand they correct their error, which they can

They dont need to refund anything, just advise the system these were errorounus debits and ensure they dont ask for them to be paid and the funds will be released

Mikeyorks

Biggles wrote: »

Hotels may have a different arrangement ..

In the case of orphaned 'reserved' amounts - it's your Banks software that brings your money back into use? So there's no distinction by trade type.