BW Legal Court Claims - Help with defense

NikiFm_2

Morning Guys,

My friend has just came back from a lovely holiday to be blessed with two letters from BW Legal for two separate contraventions dated 7th & 15th of December 2015 in the same car park (I have attached the letters for your records). My friend is completely lost in what to do, he has scoured the newbie threads and have read ruling #2 multiple times, he has taken a defense letter written by LoadsofChildren123 and adapted it to suit. He now only has 1 week to reply to the letters before they reach the court. He is scared and worried as these are the first letters he has been made aware of as I believe they had the wrong house address.

My question is, when replying to the letters does he need to write two separate replies or can he send one reply for both letters? Hope this makes sense, he's at loose ends over this.

Le_Kirk

What do the letters from BW legal say? Are they LBA/LBC/LBCC or fishing expeditions? It is unusual to receive a letter from BW legal without having previously received Notice to Driver or Notice to Keeper.

Use a hosting site like tinypic or imgur, scan the letters and then post a broken URL hxxps instead of https and a regular will make the links live after having checked them for personal information - to make sure it is not showing any.

NikiFm_2

Thank you for the quick reply,I'm not too sure. I would assume it is actually a LBCC but the more I read into it the more I get confused about what stage he's on. I think I have attached the broken links below, is this what you meant? Thanks again

Letter 1: hxxps://s36.photobucket.com/user/NikiFmLBC/library/?view=recent&page=1

Letter 2: hxxps://s36.photobucket.com/user/NikiFmLBC/library/?view=recent

Quentin

http://s36.photobucket.com/user/NikiFmLBC/library/?view=recent&page=1


That is a lbcca


See #2 in the faq for advice on how to respond to a lbcca


Respond to each sparately

NikiFm_2

Thank you for the update Quentin, Can someone clarify If it's okay to send the reply template uploaded by LoadsofChildren123? Is there anything else I should include or take away? I'm sorry for all the questions, I've read the FAQ's for hours now but I'm not to savy and haven't done anything like this before.

Dear Sirs,

Thank you for your letter dated the 3rd of July 2018 (Reference: XXXXXXX)

You have sent me a Letter Before Claim. However, your letter contains insufficient detail of the claim and fails to provide any photographic evidence. It does not say what the cause of action is, Nor does it contain any mention of what evidence your client intends to rely on, or enclose copies of such evidence.


This action on the part of your client is a clear breach of its pre-action obligations set out in the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct, with which as solicitors you must surely be familiar (and with which your client, a serial litigator of small claims, must also be familiar). As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction binds all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time.


I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. an explanation of the cause of action
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are (where it is claimed the car was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated, what contractual breach (if any) is being claimed)
5. a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim
6. a copy of any alleged contract with the driver
7. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)


I am clearly entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction. I also need it in order to comply with my own obligations under paragraph 6(b).

If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) !!!8211; Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16.
Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.

Yours faithfully,

xxxxxxxxx

Umkomaas

I think you need some perspective on whether this would reach a court stage. This isn't to say it will, or it won't (and the more tickets to pursue, the more likely), but PPS don't often frequent the small claims courtroom.

http://www.parkingappeals.info/companydata/Premier_Parking_Solutions.html

Umkomaas

Can someone clarify If it's okay to send the reply template uploaded by LoadsofChildren123?

The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Collection has superseded some of this.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/pdf/protocols/debt-pap.pdf

Do a forum search on 'LBC PAP' and look to one which includes the PAP references.

Also, practising solicitor Loadsofchildren123 has produced/guided a number of responses to LBCs, so your other search should be on 'Loadsofchildren123 PAP'.

The changes took place in October 2017, so only check out posts which have a later date.

HOW TO USE THE FORUM SEARCH FUNCTION:

Use the Forum Jump button (one near the top and one near bottom of this page) to get back to the forum thread list. Just above the threads, on the right, is a heading along a line, next to forum tools, called 'Search this Forum'. Put your key word(s) in and change the default search from 'Show Threads' to 'Show Posts'.

NikiFm_2

Thank you so much Umkomaas, I have had a look through the forums for a letter based on the updated PAP and have put this one together, does this cover the basis I need? I'm really sorry to keep hassling, I'm quite young and have never had to do anything like this before.

Dear Sirs,

I am in receipt of your Letter Before Claim of 3rd July 2018.
Your letter contains insufficient detail of the claim and fails to provide copies of evidence your client bases their claim upon.

Your client must know that on 01 October 2017 a new protocol is applicable to debt claims. Since proceedings have not yet been issued, the new protocol clearly applies and must be complied with.

Your letter lacks specificity and breaches both the requirements of the previously applicable Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct (paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c)) and the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 3.1(a)-(d), 5.1 and 5.2. Please treat this letter as a formal request for all of the documents / information that the protocol now requires your client to provide.

Your client must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol. I reserve the right to draw any failure of the Claimant to comply with the protocol to the attention of the court and to ask the court to stay the claim and order your client to comply with its pre-action obligations, and when costs come to be considered.

As solicitors you must surely be familiar with the requirements of both the Practice Direction applicable pre-1 October and the Protocol which applies thereafter (and your client, as a serial litigator of small claims, should likewise be aware of them). As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction and Protocol bind all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time. It is astounding that a firm of Solicitors are sending a consumer a vague and unevidenced 'Letter before Claim' in complete ignorance of the pre-existing Practice Direction and the new Protocol.

Nobody, including your client, is immune from the requirements and obligations of the Practice Direction and now the Protocol.

I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. an explanation of the cause of action
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are; where it is claimed the vehicle was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
7. Provide me a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by the IPC code of practice section B, clause 1.1;establishing yourself as the creditor
8. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
9. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
10. Provide details of the original charge, and detail any interest and administrative or other charges added
11. Provide a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form


If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20), Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16 of the Practice Direction, as referred to in paragraph 7.2 of the Protocol.

Furthermore, I exercise my right under Article 15 of the General Data Protection Regulation to be granted access to all personal data of mine that your client holds as a data controller. I expect this to include:

- The categories of personal data concerned
- The recipients or categories of recipient your client discloses my personal data to
- The necessary processing agreement between UK Parking Limited CSB solicitors, to ensure you are handling my data in a legally compliant manner
- Your clients retention period for storing my personal data
- The existence of my right to request rectification, erasure or restriction or to object to such processing
- My rights to lodge a complaint with the ICO.
- Information about the source of the data your client holds on me
- Information about the existence of automated decision-making (including profiling)
- The safeguards your client provides if they transfer personal data to a third country or international organisation.


Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided

NikiFm_2

Can anyone confirm? Sorry to bug, only as I have to send it today else I won't reach their deadline

nosferatu1001

Its about right
Seriously
There are dozens of these on here. Youre not expecting a huge amount from this - its just a formal response they may r may not deal with properly.

peter_the_piper

As you think that the paperwork went to a wrong address, make sure the DVLA has the current one to ensure any future dealings can be sorted quickly. Note that drivers licence and car registration are different, changing one does NOT change the other