Returning to work after maternity leave, and annual leave

Cupcakey

Comms69 wrote: »

Careful, what if the only A/L you get authorised is every other Wednesday from now until end of the year (or however much you have accumulated).


And no tact and diplomacy doesn't work both ways. You want something, they don't.

I'm not contracted to work Wednesdays so that wouldn't happen. I get what you're saything though. But that's not how it works. You can't take AL at Christmas, but can request it at any other time of year. All AL is requested, so you submit the request and they come back to you with yes or no. It's detailed this way in our contracts.

And yes, tact and diplomacy works both ways. I want something, and so does my employer. I wasn't going to return to work after ML, but they don't want me to leave so they have offered me weekends only. Leaving would mean that they would have to advertise the job, employ someone and spend 9-12 months training them before they are qualified to do it. I have a lot of very broad experience in the disciplinary and it's very unlikely that they would find someone else with the same. I could potentially hand in my notice, which would be bad for both of us. So the respect here is mutual.

warby68

Cupcakey wrote: »

She's getting the emails. I sent her an email with my return to work date, and included a holiday request in the same email. They asked me to do this. They flat out told me to give them 8 weeks notice of my return to work, and they asked me to include any AL requests. So I did. She confirmed my return to work date, no mention of the holiday.

I've done nothing wrong. What are you implying? That I submit my leave requests attached to a bunch of roses? It's unfortunate that you think I believe I'm entitled. It's hard for me to disagree with you that this isn't about what the company owes me, because that's exactly what this post is about, annual leave. They owe me annual leave and I would like to use it, as per my contract and the company's own rules.

It's interesting that you mention tact and diplomacy. It works both ways, doesn't it?

I rest my case

Comms69

Cupcakey wrote: »

I'm not contracted to work Wednesdays so that wouldn't happen. I get what you're saything though. But that's not how it works. You can't take AL at Christmas, but can request it at any other time of year. All AL is requested, so you submit the request and they come back to you with yes or no. It's detailed this way in our contracts. - indeed, but employers must give opportunity to take A/L, so if they reject a request, it's sensible (not required though) to offer an alternative. Remember it is a request and they can so no.

And yes, tact and diplomacy works both ways. - sorry it doesn't, it should perhaps. But the king does not negotiate with the knight... I want something, and so does my employer. I wasn't going to return to work after ML, but they don't want me to leave so they have offered me weekends only. - No-one is irreplaceable. Leaving would mean that they would have to advertise the job, employ someone and spend 9-12 months training them before they are qualified to do it. - that might be true, but it's 2 shifts to cover, even if the existing workforce wasn't able to do that; businesses know that people leave all the time. I have a lot of very broad experience in the disciplinary and it's very unlikely that they would find someone else with the same. I could potentially hand in my notice, which would be bad for both of us. So the respect here is mutual.

Sorry no. At some point you were hired to do the job. Which means that someone left. Which means the business can cope with people leaving.


Additionally you've been on maternity leave, which means the business covered substantially more hours that you weren't working an survived.


They may not 'want' to. But like all business it's a balancing act, at some point they may decide it's easier to replace you then to keep you on.


That said - I don't actually disagree with you about wanting A/L. It's perfectly reasonable.


If you've ever heard the phrase 'he/she was managed out of the business' this is what it looks like. Making things slightly unpleasant but with-in the scope of the law.

sangie595

It's possibly too obvious an answer, but if you are willing to resign over this, wouldn't it be simpler to go back to work in a few days time - next week is only a few days away - and tackle the conversation face to face? Surely, if you actually want to stay in the job, then it's worth doing it that way? It's not incoming for managers to promise to get back to you, but the pressures of the job, day to day, mean it simply gets forgotten.

Cupcakey

Comms69 wrote: »

Sorry no. At some point you were hired to do the job. Which means that someone left. Which means the business can cope with people leaving.


Additionally you've been on maternity leave, which means the business covered substantially more hours that you weren't working an survived.


They may not 'want' to. But like all business it's a balancing act, at some point they may decide it's easier to replace you then to keep you on.


That said - I don't actually disagree with you about wanting A/L. It's perfectly reasonable.


If you've ever heard the phrase 'he/she was managed out of the business' this is what it looks like. Making things slightly unpleasant but with-in the scope of the law.

I feel like I'm just repeating myself, so I'm going to address your points and then leave it alone. This isn't helpful.

Yes, it's a request. I have submitted a request for AL. They can refuse it. But they haven't. They haven't accepted it or refused it, it's just gone ignored. This is my issue.

Clearly, "tact and diplomacy" isn't working right now, since my line manager doesn't even want to communicate with me. But as you said, it should. Why argue with me and then say "oh yeah, so it should"?

I'm clearly not irreplaceable. I never said that. I said they don't want me to leave. I have a lot of experience, and they would like me to continue working there. This was made clear when they offered me the chance to reduce my hours from full time to two days only. I was going to leave, but they reduced my hoirs instead. It was also made clear that they didn't want me to leave when the general manager phoned me up and said "I don't want you to leave". It's actually really nice to be wanted.

People do leave jobs. Obviously. This doesn't mean that business want to have to retrain someone, and it doesn't mean that their existing staff mean nothing to them. Yes I had maternity cover. I'm going back this week.

Thanks for !!!!ing all over my chips with your final comment.

gettingtheresometime

technology is a wonderful thing but actually speaking to the manager - whether in person (hard to ignore you then) or by phone is sometimes more appropriate.

Comms69

Cupcakey wrote: »

I feel like I'm just repeating myself, so I'm going to address your points and then leave it alone. This isn't helpful.

Yes, it's a request. I have submitted a request for AL. They can refuse it. But they haven't. They haven't accepted it or refused it, it's just gone ignored. This is my issue. - yes I understand that, I just meant applying pressure may not get the desired result. Perhaps a face to face discussion would be more fruitful?

Clearly, "tact and diplomacy" isn't working right now, since my line manager doesn't even want to communicate with me. But as you said, it should. Why argue with me and then say "oh yeah, so it should"? - I'm not arguing, I can agree with someone's moral position of how something 'should be' but also point out there's no requirement for it to be that way.

I'm clearly not irreplaceable. I never said that. I said they don't want me to leave. I have a lot of experience, and they would like me to continue working there. This was made clear when they offered me the chance to reduce my hours from full time to two days only. I was going to leave, but they reduced my hoirs instead. It was also made clear that they didn't want me to leave when the general manager phoned me up and said "I don't want you to leave". It's actually really nice to be wanted. - that's great. Again I'm just saying don't overplay your hand.

People do leave jobs. Obviously. This doesn't mean that business want to have to retrain someone, and it doesn't mean that their existing staff mean nothing to them. Yes I had maternity cover. I'm going back this week.

Thanks for !!!!ing all over my chips with your final comment.

I certainly wasn't trying to wet your chips. This does happen. I've seen it happen.


I have resigned over something similar - with no regrets. But it was a personal decision, not a threat.


I do hope that it's just an oversight and all is well. Forewarned is forearmed and all that.

Cupcakey

gettingtheresometime wrote: »

technology is a wonderful thing but actually speaking to the manager - whether in person (hard to ignore you then) or by phone is sometimes more appropriate.

So true! Definitely easier by phone, but it just isn't always that easy to get hold of them that way, so I tend to go in when I can.

Cupcakey

Comms69 wrote: »

I certainly wasn't trying to wet your chips. This does happen. I've seen it happen.


I have resigned over something similar - with no regrets. But it was a personal decision, not a threat.


I do hope that it's just an oversight and all is well. Forewarned is forearmed and all that.

My resignation would never be a threat. I'm not in a position to resign out of spite. But I have a very cute 9-month-old and a partner who works long hours Monday-Friday, I'd like a holiday with them, and to spend their birthdays with them. Especially my baby's first. If I can't juggle working (even just weeknds) with family time then I need to rethink my job, because I definitely can't rethink my family.

Comms69

Cupcakey wrote: »

My resignation would never be a threat. I'm not in a position to resign out of spite. But I have a very cute 9-month-old and a partner who works long hours Monday-Friday, I'd like a holiday with them, and to spend their birthdays with them. Especially my baby's first. If I can't juggle working (even just weeknds) with family time then I need to rethink my job, because I definitely can't rethink my family.

Absolutely, and that may be the best decision if you factor in costs vs benefits.


(though these may be limited if your partner has a well paying job)