Revolut asks for photo id, but refuses photo with id theft protection

alexrw

"presenting your face and passport in person at a mainstream bank's branch" does not open yourself to identity theft. There is a reason why modern Fintechs actually require you to include an additional written+dated+signed piece of paper in the photo, e.g. https://support.kraken.com/hc/en-us/articles/204061056

A lot of Revolut users did not submit any documents (only those whose accounts get locked or want topup limit increases are required to) ... but even so, if protecting the ID photo isn't against the law or T&Cs, then requiring it citing regulations and T&Cs is in fact problematic. I'm not telling you what to do though.

Chino

alexrw wrote: »

There is a reason why modern Fintechs actually require you to include an additional written+dated+signed piece of paper in the photo, e.g. https://support.kraken.com/hc/en-us/articles/204061056

If you look at the figures on the page you link to you will see that Kraken require that the piece of paper does not obscure any part of the identity document.

masonic

alexrw wrote: »

"presenting your face and passport in person at a mainstream bank's branch" does not open yourself to identity theft.

In my experience, part of that process is a member of staff taking the passport from the customer and going to a back office to photocopy it. If you don't think that opens a customer to identity theft, then I fail to see why uploading a photo via secure app is any worse.

peterbaker

Well done OceanSound.

You wrote of your experience in another thread on the subject, didn't you which got closed? I apologise for my part in that which seemed to incense the regulars here who seem to think that there's only one process and you have to follow it.

Until I read your reminder of "another way" to alexw just now, I was about to suggest that alexw if persistent enough could try a long robust call to FCA whistleblowing line which I have managed several times over the years on various subjects.

I've never used FOS - especially since in an earlier job one of their erstwhile higher ups was responsible for propounding the PPI scandal in their region long after FSA had already set a looming deadline for it to stop. Said person didn't take my direct hint or FSA's hint and continued to press for more PPI sales right up to the deadline. Such was the culture back then, and so it remains. I.e. if it is arguably still legal and we want to do it, don't stop.

FCA try to avoid talking to customers on the whistleblowing line, but they really ought to listen to any customer who has the b@lls to short-circuit the process and bang a drum about a p-poor general situation.

But OceanSound seems to have got the better trick of it on this one.

alexrw

Chino wrote: »

If you look at the figures on the page you link to you will see that Kraken require that the piece of paper does not obscure any part of the identity document.

Check again how much the fingers overlap the ID. My piece of paper overlaps *less* than that on the margin. I've been verified on Kraken too, and many other Fintechs, in the same way.

masonic wrote: »

In my experience, part of that process is a member of staff taking the passport from the customer and going to a back office to photocopy it. If you don't think that opens a customer to identity theft, then I fail to see why uploading a photo via secure app is any worse.

First, as I said earlier in the thread, that was not my experience with Halifax and HSBC. They did look at my passport on the spot (and I think wrote down some of its details) but did not take a copy. Second, a photocopy done with a black&white photocopier (not even grayscale) is incomparably much less of an issue. A high resolution color photo of the ID is not something I want to leave with a company. Third, as I also mentioned, Revolut initially insisted the photos be posted on the chat, where general support employees have access (who shouldn't), which isn't secure, and needed 30 minutes of persuasion to accept them uploaded via the special "documents upload" feature of the app. I still have the chat logs, which will go into my complaint, along with the inconsistent treatment of the issue given they accepted similar photos for my wife.

AndyPix

Devils advocate =>


You made a slit in the passport , inserted another photo, and then covered the slit with a piece of paper and made up some nonesense about ID theft

alexrw

There is a reason why the devil still keeps that nonsensical advocate on retainer

masonic

alexrw wrote: »

First, as I said earlier in the thread, that was not my experience with Halifax and HSBC.

Well interestingly I've had different experiences with both Halifax and HSBC.

At Halifax, the cashier took my passport and disappeared to a back office ("to make a copy") and returned about 5 minutes later to hand me back the document.

At HSBC, I was ushered into someone's cubicle and they completed my account application on the computer with me, then put my passport in a multifunction printer and took a colour scan, which they then printed and attached to my paperwork before sending me on my way.

I have no issue with either of the above processes (other than the inconvenience of having to visit a branch). I'd be more concerned if I was handing over certified copies, which would be accepted elsewhere without checking the applicant matches the photograph on the ID.

Edit: to bring this back on topic, an encrypted and cryptographically signed photograph transmitted through the secure app would be preferable to any of the above in my view. Presumably that is what Revolut is doing.

alexrw

"an encrypted and cryptographically signed photograph transmitted through the secure app would be preferable to any of the above in my view. Presumably that is what Revolut is doing."

No, that's not what Revolut did, as I explained (several times), and no that would not be preferable to a black and white (not grayscale) photocopy, particularly when others have access to them who shouldn't. I'm new on these forums, but I'm starting to see why some individuals do not want to entertain replies.

I guess my questions regarding law and regulations and possible courses of action, the topic of the thread, received all the answers this community could muster, so I consider the matter closed as I'm not learning anything new. It's been off topic for a while.

A mod can feel free to close this thread

masonic

alexrw wrote: »

"an encrypted and cryptographically signed photograph transmitted through the secure app would be preferable to any of the above in my view. Presumably that is what Revolut is doing."

No, that's not what Revolut did, as I explained (several times),

I'm only going by what you yourself said:

alexrw wrote: »

They asked for it in the chat of the app (the app is totally blocked except for the chat) The same chat is visible by all customer service employees (not all employees should have access to such sensitive customer information, but that's another issue).

It seems like there are some assumptions being made on your part, which might lead to you misunderstanding the process. Or perhaps you are saying that there was no function within the app available to you that would take control of your camera to generate the photograph?

Alternatively, if what you actually meant was you were told in the chat within the app to send it by some other means, then that would be a problem.

I guess my questions regarding law and regulations and possible courses of action, the topic of the thread, received all the answers this community could muster, so I consider the matter closed as I'm not learning anything new. It's been off topic for a while.

A mod can feel free to close this thread

Obviously, if you feel this thread is no longer of interest to you, you can stop reading it, but this is a discussion forum where others are free to continue the conversation in your absence. Sometimes there will be further contributions others will find useful.