eBay Item Never Received

NaughtiusMaximus

MataNui wrote: »

I propose a new delivery standard that you could choose for high value items that would be bio-metrically signed for. So either a finger print or retina scan. Cant see any issues with that since the technology is now widely available and not prohibitively expensive. Either way the current standards of tracked and signed for are simply not fit for purpose and may as well not be used since neither even remotely guarantee delivery to the addressee over any random Joe Bloggs the postie meets in the street.

That's overkill, there is a lower tech option which would be viable.

Delivery companies could offer a service whereby for a small surcharge the sender could state the parcel can only be signed for by the addressee or an alternate named person AND the recipient would be required to show the courier proof of ID which would be scanned to confirm receipt by that individual.

MataNui

NaughtiusMaximus wrote: »

That's overkill, there is a lower tech option which would be viable.

Delivery companies could offer a service whereby for a small surcharge the sender could state the parcel can only be signed for by the addressee or an alternate named person AND the recipient would be required to show the courier proof of ID which would be scanned to confirm receipt by that individual.

Thats not a bad idea. Point is there needs to be an optional service that people can sign up for (for high value items) that does guarantee the item is delivered to the person who orders it or to a person nominated because the current choices are not fit for purpose.


At the moment neither signed for or tracked give any confidence that you will :
a. Get your item.
b. Have any recourse if you dont.


All current delivery options leave the buyer open to deliberate theft or just lazy/incompetent delivery people with no comeback at all.
Tracked means nothing.
Signed for means nothing.
If you dont want to use the new service then you wont have to. I would imagine the delivery companies would rather not use it either. Much easier to not have a system that actually forces them to do the job properly.

custardy

MataNui wrote: »

Happens a lot. Dont think its so much 'bad posties' as plain just plain lazy ones. I had an item recently that was large, signed for. I watched as the postman (Parcel Force) delivered it next door then just left it on his doorstep in full view of the road. He didnt even attempt delivery to my address although both houses and the address on the label were clear. As it was a signed for the !!!! obviously forged the signature too.


I propose a new delivery standard that you could choose for high value items that would be bio-metrically signed for. So either a finger print or retina scan. Cant see any issues with that since the technology is now widely available and not prohibitively expensive. Either way the current standards of tracked and signed for are simply not fit for purpose and may as well not be used since neither even remotely guarantee delivery to the addressee over any random Joe Bloggs the postie meets in the street.

When did couriers start being referred to as posties?
So you want your finger print/retina scan held on couriers databases?

custardy

NaughtiusMaximus wrote: »

That's overkill, there is a lower tech option which would be viable.

Delivery companies could offer a service whereby for a small surcharge the sender could state the parcel can only be signed for by the addressee or an alternate named person AND the recipient would be required to show the courier proof of ID which would be scanned to confirm receipt by that individual.

You say a small surcharge. However the time wasted waiting on people finding & producing ID cuts down number of deliveries per day massively.
Aslo,would you be happy with a scan of your passport getting uploaded onto a couriers server?

soolin

custardy wrote: »

You say a small surcharge. However the time wasted waiting on people finding & producing ID cuts down number of deliveries per day massively.
Aslo,would you be happy with a scan of your passport getting uploaded onto a couriers server?

I agree, I can't remember the exact time frame that a courier is expected to deliver a single parcel in, but it is minutes and not very long. So if we are not very generous and assume most people could find and produce photographic ID in say 3 minutes ? That could quadruple at least the parcel cost. I do have a photo driving license, my OH still has a paper one, so would need to leave courier on doorstep, get the step ladders, move a few storage folders, retrieve the 'important document' folder, grab passport , go back to door- so a fair wait for the courier.

I assume he would then need to sign some sort of declaration to allow his scanned passport to be retained in case of a later claim (which I assure you he would not do, neither would I) at which point I assume courier would not be able to leave parcel as he would have no proof against a claim, so we would then be obtaining a refund from seller , who would be considerably out of pocket for a failed delivery.

mrsc1964

Good news and an update.



I have finally received another Kindle from the original eBay supplier.


This has been a long-winded battle, because as I explained at the outset, the eBay supplier had 'proof' of royal mail delivery, even though I had never received it. (Also, bear in mind this was *not* a signed for item, just plain First Class Package).



I elected to raise an investigation via PayPal, as I thought my long-standing good record (umpteen years) would carry weight.



I rarely buy via eBay and don't have much of a record. I thought this might not go in my favour - as they clearly need to weigh up the balance of probability that I'm either a long-standing customer with a good record, or a scammer.


PayPal very quickly found *against* me due to the supplier providing "sufficient proof of delivery". (Their investigation took 2 days)!



Once a PayPal resolution has been finalised you can't open it again (unless the item has eventually arrived but not in the condition you expect it). Additionally, if you open a PayPal investigation, you can't open an eBay one for the same item.


So I opened an investigation with royal mail who basically kept fobbing me off with "it has been delivered".



I kept at it until I eventually escalated it to the royal mail review panel. They came back with an apology for the inconvenience, admitted they had clearly failed to meet my expectations, and told me that under these circumstances, they would normally expect the supplier to provide me the customer with a refund/replacement and then the supplier seek compensation from royal mail for the loss.


I went back to the eBay supplier, this time with a letter, enclosing copies of all the correspondence. Thankfully they sent me a replacement - this time by signed for delivery.




Perhaps raising this investigation with eBay instead, might have resulted in a better outcome. They do state that they have a 30-day money back guarantee. But my guess is they can only be guided by what they see online, i.e., my buyer's track record online, which as I say, I have very little. (They're clearly not going to have a chat with my local posty, are they!!)


If someone else here has had a good result with eBay in a similar situation, then let us know.



I think the only thing I can suggest in these scenarios is to keep pushing.


I do find it infuriating that eBay/PayPal have this rather circular complaint system that essentially has you running around in circles (going nowhere fast).


Sorry for the long update, but perhaps it will help someone else if they're in a similar situation.


Ciao

theonlywayisup

mrsc1964 wrote: »

Good news and an update.



I have finally received another Kindle from the original eBay supplier.

A good result. Thank you for reporting back.

mrsc1964 wrote: »

I elected to raise an investigation via PayPal, as I thought my long-standing good record (umpteen years) would carry weight.

Thankfully Paypal don't resolve cases on longevity and integrity of the account but on evidence of delivery (for INR). I understand the delivery was disputed in your case but there has to be a standard way to prove delivery and this is how both eBay and Paypal chose to decide it.

mrsc1964 wrote: »

Perhaps raising this investigation with eBay instead, might have resulted in a better outcome. They do state that they have a 30-day money back guarantee. But my guess is they can only be guided by what they see online, i.e., my buyer's track record online, which as I say, I have very little. (They're clearly not going to have a chat with my local posty, are they!!)

As per Paypal, eBay will only rule in favour of the tracking. Tracking is exactly that, a proof of delivery and doesn't require a signature unless over £750. Your track record is irrelevant.

mrsc1964 wrote: »

I do find it infuriating that eBay/PayPal have this rather circular complaint system that essentially has you running around in circles (going nowhere fast).

It isn't circular. POD was showing the item as delivered. It's cut and dry as far as eBay and Paypal are concerned. A good seller will always dispute the delivery with the carrier if the buyer states the item wasn't received.

Glad you got it sorted in the end.

[Deleted User]

custardy wrote: »

Very accurate. GPS can take you right to the door.
Its not officially declared but GPS is always on with the PDAs now(not just at point of scanning) so a posties entire route is GPS tracked.
The old set up was only at scan point.

RM is pushing on with 'Safeplace'. PDAs have been updated to allow pictures to be taken when items are left in a safeplace.
Technically items should only be left in a safeplace when it is officially printed on the label (Tracked products only) but you & I know it happens far more with multiple products.
They have also tweaked the software to allow records of what neighbour items are left with.

Simple fact is its cheaper/less work for RM if items are 'delivered first time'.
Callers offices,redeliveries etc cost time & money.

GPS is only accurate to 5 metres under optimum conditions, built up areas, especially blocks of flats make matters worse, it would be very easy for a postie to go to the wrong address in a 5 metre radius and still show as delivered to the correct address.