Flexible working hours

FBaby

7-3
8-4
9-5
10-6

Are these the days you are doing? Are you working only 4 days, and one of those you finish at 3pm? Have you considered that maybe someone working FT has asked to not work on the day you are now finishing at 4pm because they want to do a course on that day that starts at 5pm and they've been told that it's not possible because they need them to finish at 6pm on that day?

It's easy to consider yourself a victim because you are being selective in where you want to see unfairness.

discat11

Is the department represented by a union rep?
Is this union rep one of the 10 or one of the 20?
If it's the former I'd suggest the next opportunity you get you elect someone from the 20.

Also if 20 of you are being unfairly treated in a department of 30 it should be fairly easy to prove to management it isn't in their best interests to allow this to continue -the HR department will confirm if sickness levels have increased also.

A company needs only to consider a formal request for flexible working and can indeed grant or not grant or even take away flexible working for one of several criteria including it having an adverse effect on other work colleagues.

TELLIT01

First come, first served leave or working hour booking systems are by their very nature unfair if everbody doesn't work the same hours prior to its introduction. If you have a situation where some start at 8am but others don't start until 10am, and the new system is introduced first thing in the morning, the likelihood is that those with the early start will effectively get their first choice and the later starters get the dregs.
It may not be illegal but it does indicate an organisation which really either hasn't thought it through or doesn't give a damn about staff morale.

bugslet

Cainster wrote: »

The people who are now left to do all the later shifts are now very upset, not sleeping, poor health etc because we will never get a choice of earlier shifts or booking half days etc.

I had some sympathy till that point - if that is causing ill health and sleepless nights, may I suggest you try a job where you never know when, possibly which day you are going to finish, but it'll be lucky if it's 6 p.m. and then you might realise that whilst it's irritating that you didn't ask for flexible working, it is actually your fault.

LilElvis

Cainster wrote: »

I am one of approx 20 people who did not apply for it as we just want to work a fair rota so a fair distribution of early and late shifts on Fridays. The selfish people ( as described by the union) applied for early shifts on Fridays ( even though they want to work Saturdays as overtime). The people who are now left to do all the later shifts are now very upset, not sleeping, poor health etc because we will never get a choice of earlier shifts or booking half days etc. You have to swap to an early shift if you want a half day, but there is no flexibility to swap now. It!!!8217;s causing a lot of friction on the department.

You can still take a half day if you wish - you need to follow your company's holiday booking procedure and utilise your holiday entitlement.

Rosemary7391

LilElvis wrote: »

You can still take a half day if you wish - you need to follow your company's holiday booking procedure and utilise your holiday entitlement.

Is that the case though? It seems like there is no other cover for Friday late shifts. If so the OP might find that all holiday requests including a Friday are denied. If that's what they're complaining about then I see their problem.

sangie595

Rosemary7391 wrote: »

Is that the case though? It seems like there is no other cover for Friday late shifts. If so the OP might find that all holiday requests including a Friday are denied. If that's what they're complaining about then I see their problem.

But that isn't what they are complaining about. They are complaining about not getting flexible working that they didn't ask for until it was too late. They haven't even mentioned holiday requests. But there is a point to be made here. Nobody has a right to take holiday when they want. Nobody had a right to time off when they want. Nobody had a right to work the hours that they want. And if they kick up a big enough fuss offer something they didn't even ask for, then the employer could decide that they'll be happy to abide by the letter of the law in all things in future. When an employer decides to do that, it isn't them that loses out. Anyone fancy annual leave on Mondays and Tuesdays only?

Comms69

Cainster wrote: »

I work in a department of about 30 people. Recently my company have allowed Flexible working hours. But they are allowing it for any reason, in fact you don’t have to give a reason. People finish to work in pubs, go to gym, just because they can. Approx 10 people have requested early shifts on Fridays so they can finish at 4pm every week. There are only so many 8-4 shifts and the rest of the workforce have to have the leftover shifts up to 6pm. The people who did NOT request any changes to shifts and just want a fair rota are now suffering as they get late shifts every Friday with no option to swap as the earlier shifts are ‘gone’ and ‘not available ‘. These were done on a first come first served basis. The companies HR dept say they are doing nothing wrong and it is the law to allow these flexible hours. Is this discrimination and unfair on the rest of workforce. Any advice will be appreciated.

Discrimination on what grounds?


You/they didn't ask for any specific shifts, therefore you were given these.


Do professional people really need their hand holding?

Rosemary7391

sangie595 wrote: »

But that isn't what they are complaining about. They are complaining about not getting flexible working that they didn't ask for until it was too late.


They haven't even mentioned holiday requests.



But there is a point to be made here. Nobody has a right to take holiday when they want. Nobody had a right to time off when they want. Nobody had a right to work the hours that they want. And if they kick up a big enough fuss offer something they didn't even ask for, then the employer could decide that they'll be happy to abide by the letter of the law in all things in future. When an employer decides to do that, it isn't them that loses out. Anyone fancy annual leave on Mondays and Tuesdays only?

You're quite right on your latter points of course and nope, don't fancy not being able to take a full week off although realize that my only remedy in such a situation would be to seek new employment.



I think I had a slightly different reading of the OP than you, ie that they were upset about the impact of the flexible working on them.



Bit in bold - see OP quote:

Cainster wrote:

We cannot book early finishes to go away at weekends, special occasions, etc.

It's not clear whether that refers to standard annual leave booking (either in half or full day increments) or being allowed to swap to early shifts. If it's the former - it's legal but most everyone would be irritated about it! If it's the latter OP will just have to save annual leave for those occasions.

okborednow

Cainster wrote: »

I work in a department of about 30 people. Recently my company have allowed Flexible working hours. But they are allowing it for any reason, in fact you don’t have to give a reason. People finish to work in pubs, go to gym, just because they can. Approx 10 people have requested early shifts on Fridays so they can finish at 4pm every week. There are only so many 8-4 shifts and the rest of the workforce have to have the leftover shifts up to 6pm. The people who did NOT request any changes to shifts and just want a fair rota are now suffering as they get late shifts every Friday with no option to swap as the earlier shifts are ‘gone’ and ‘not available ‘. These were done on a first come first served basis. The companies HR dept say they are doing nothing wrong and it is the law to allow these flexible hours. Is this discrimination and unfair on the rest of workforce. Any advice will be appreciated.

Hi Cainster I start by saying that i'm sorry you're finding yourself in this situation which I understand must be annoying particularly in the case of taking holidays on Friday. You said you have a meeting with your manager in 2 weeks so i would mention it there as it really doesn't seem fair that you can never have a full week off. I get that the 8-4 shift is now fixed for these people but have any of you asked them if they're prepared to swap occasionally so you can have a holiday. I'd like to hope at least some of them would be prepared to be considerate and reasonable if it's only occasional.


Having said that though I do feel you and the others who didn't apply may have been a teeny bit naive. Call me cynical but if that was implemented in my office I'd toss my hat in the ring and state what shifts i'd want because i'd be positive other people would be doing exactly the same. I would also be assuming the prime targets would be early finish on a Friday and late start on a Monday to prolong the weekend.



I get that two thirds of you didn't want things to change but if your management made it clear flexible working would now be an option I would be positive people would apply and if I didn't also i'd just end up getting screwed over like you guys have unfortunately. So if for example you'd all seen that there was a lot of applications for Friday early finish and you'd all applied for it they may have been forced to look for a fair way to implement it but you didn't so they didn't.


You can of course bring it up with your manager and explain that it's causing bad feeling within the team but they may take the view that because you had the option to apply and didn't that you can't really complain about it after the fact. I would give that up as a bad job i'm afraid and focus on the impact it's having on holiday availability to see if you can get any resolution for this.


Best of luck