grandparents taking me to court for custody of my children

FBaby

Did your wife had no contact with her parents at all and your children never got to know them? Did they suddenly come around expecting contact after your wife passed away?

gixer71100

TBagpuss wrote: »

OK, from what you say, it sounds as though the appointment you have this week is the first appointment. Is that right?

If so, then it explains a few things.

Cafcass Before the first appointment, Cafcass do safeguarding checks. This measn that they speak briefly to you, and to the applicants, about the application and what you each want, and what concerns you have. They also take personal details to do a check to see whether any party is known to police, probation or social services. Before the hearing they will send a letter to the court, copied to you and the grandparents, summarising those conversations, telliing the court whether there is any history with police or social services and if so, whether it is of a nature which might be relevant to the proceedings.

They *don't* talk to the children at this stage as they have not been ordered to by the court.

At the first appointment, a Cafcass reporter will be at court. They will give you the chance to talk to cafcass and the grandparents to see if you can agree on any contact, before you go in to court to speak to the Judge or magistrates. They will also, when you do go into court, be present and will tell the Judge if they think it would be appropriate for them to do a full report.

If the Judge thinks that would be useful, then an order will be made for a report and it will involve them then speaking to the children, and to any third parties, such as the school, they think are relevant.

Statements You mention that you have sent 14 statements to the applicant's solicitor. Why? You should not be doing an statements at all unless the Court has ordered them. I suspect that what you were advised is that if you send any documents to the court, you should also send copies to the applicant's solicitors. However, if at this stage you've just got a 1st hearing coming up, all you should be sending is the Acknowledgement of Service (C7) and, if the grandparents includes a C1A, the back page of that filled in with your response to their allegations of harm, or if they didn't, but you wish to allege that they have caused harm to you or the children, your own completed C1A.

At the first appointment, if an agreement is not reached, the Court will go on to decide what evidence it will need in order to make a decision about the children This may include giving you permission to file statements. It would be extremely unusual for it to be appropriate to have as many as 14 statements. In most cases, the court will only need statements from the applicant and the respondent i.e. from the grandparents, and from you.

If you think that other statements are necessary, think carefully about why, and who should provide a statement. For instance, if you are alleging that the grandparents have been abusive, it might be relevant to provide a statement from the person who witnessed that abuse. If a lot of people saw the same incident, pick one or two of them.

It is almost never relevant to have 'character witnesses' in family cases.

Also, bear in mind that the court is going to be making a decision based on what is in the best interests of the children, looking forward. You have made clear that you would be willing for the children to see their grandparents, but you would like that contact to be supervised. So the questions the court will have will be about Why you feel the contact should be supervised. What harm do you think will be caused to the children if it is unsupervised? When and how will it progress ? What would have to change for you to be happy with contact being unsupervised, in the future?

Then think about whether you need statements from anyone except yourself to be able to give the court the information they need to make a decision.

For instance, if you allege that the grandparents have harassed you and that has been witnessed by the children, then it might be relevant to have a statement from a person who witnessed that first hand. It would not be relevant to have statements from people who heard about it later, or who had similar experiences themselves.

It won't normally be appropriate to file statements from people if the statements are simply giving opinions, or if they are about things the children are saying (Cafcass will be asked to do a report if it is necessary to hear from the children)

Be prepared to justify to the Judge or Magistrates why you need to file any extra statements. Think about what information, specifically, the witness can provide that is directly relevant to the issue the court is deciding.

Speaking to the applicant's representative IT's common for a first appointment to include provision that you must be at court an hour before the time the hearing is listed, and even if the order doesn't say that, it is sensible to arrive early to allow time for discussion. It is normal to talk to the other person's solicitor or barrister to see whether any agreement can be reached about the contact, and if not, to try to agree 'directions' (the order the court needs to make to allow things to progress, e.g. details of who is to file statements, whether a cafcass report is needed and if so what it needs to cover, and so on)


You might find it helpful to join the 'Wikivorce' forum where you will find others who have been through a similar situation.

Thank you for your help, I have been guided by PSU . It sounds like I've done it all wrong.

gixer71100

getmore4less wrote: »

Why no mention of children's services?

Hi, I have a family support worker, I did a self referal through MASH . I asked for help once my wife died as she did most of the parenting. I went to work. We were seperated before she died and we were waiting for our divirce but I came home to care for her and the children before she died. I dont feel I have to justify to the court what kind of husband I was but to justify what kind of dad I am.

gixer71100

FBaby wrote: »

Did your wife had no contact with her parents at all and your children never got to know them? Did they suddenly come around expecting contact after your wife passed away?

Hi, yes my wife had contact with her mum and step dad, but a couple of months after she was diagnosed she didnt want them near the children or herself. She always told me they bullied her and tbh I felt bullied and harrassed by them during our marridge. My wife told me not to let the children go to their house or have contact. She told me I had to protect them. But she sadly never made a disclosure to me. Sadly my wife cannot verbalise this now....

gixer71100

Armorica wrote: »

The time to ask was probably earlier in the process.

You shouldn't go to Court alone. Make sure you take a friend or colleague. A family member would find it difficult.

Are you a member of a union at work? Sometimes that comes with free legal advice? And some employers provide it as a service as well.

I am not a member of a union. My employer doesn't offer that service.I have been advised so far by PSU (personal support unit.). A gentleman from the unit will come into the court with me for the first hearing this week. I am to see the applicants barrister before the hearing. Thank you

gixer71100

geminilady wrote: »

I presume the step grandad was reported to the police,what happened?

No, sadly we have only just learnt of this, through statements. Also I must point out that this is not my child in this position it was my wife! My wife always felt intimidated by her mum and step father. Its so difficult when she has gone. I can't ask her more questions. I feel that my daughter may have already been hurt and now want to protect her and my son. We really haven't had time to grieve.

getmore4less

gixer71100 wrote: »

Hi, I have a family support worker, I did a self referal through MASH . I asked for help once my wife died as she did most of the parenting. I went to work. We were seperated before she died and we were waiting for our divirce but I came home to care for her and the children before she died. I dont feel I have to justify to the court what kind of husband I was but to justify what kind of dad I am.

I suspect you will need a much greater involvement from Child services as you are claiming there is a serious safety issue for the vulnerable children involved with this custody battle.


There is a chance the court could decide take them into care while there are investigations if both sides are claiming the others are not suitable to take on parental responsibility.

you also need to make your guardianship statement, should you die you need to have the legal docs in place which decides the default new person(s) with parental control.

TBagpuss

It's highly unlikely that the children's services will become involved. OP is currently protecting the children by ensuring that they aren't brought into contact with (potentially) abusive family members, so there would be no need for children's services to become involved.

Children are not lightly taken into care, and that only happens where a child is has suffered, or is at risk of suffering, significant harm, if those steps are not taken. Here, the risk of harm is from grandparents, who the children do not live with.

FBaby

Also we feel on a practical level they wouldnt be able to look after them and their needs.

Who is 'we'? Are you with someone else now? If so, that could cloud the issue even more.

As you say, without any evidence that your ex wife didn't want the kids to have any contact with her family, you are going to struggle to use this as a reason for no contact. You say that she was abused etc... but if she had had any concerns that they would treat the kids as they treated her, she would never have allowed contact from the time they were born.

I think you're going to have to come up with a much stronger argument if you want to convince any judge that it is about the welfare of the kids rather than your own agenda.