Executor speed (?)

SBTaxi

Although I'm fairly sure that it's a common problem I'm experiencing, I couldn't find any threads relating to my question. Namely, what, if anything, can be done to get an executor of a will's bum into action.

Detail:- My mum died in March this year (11th), two days later, I notified her solicitor, who was also executor, of this fact. On 14th executor acknowledged that they were they to act for my mum's estate and sent various forms to be completed, which they were. They were happy that (initially) scanned documents e.g. death certificate, were sent as long as the original was also sent via post to"make things quicker and easier for us". We were told that any expenditure items should be sent as scans and the originals sent by post. This was done by recorded delivery, so we know that they have received all the information that has been asked for.

A month after the funeral, which was delayed by a couple of weeks to allow overseas family to make arrangements, I received the final invoice from the Funeral Director. I phoned them and explained that I would be passing this onto the executor for their attention and was re-assured that this was common, but wanted their details which I passed on to avoid being the middle man. Two weeks later the funeral director contacted me again, verifying the contact details I had given them and they were correct. Last week I contacted the Funeral Directors to see if they had received payment as there had been somethings that my siblings and I had requested from the executor but had not yet received a response. They had not been paid.

One of my siblings and I are now starting to get concerned about the speed at which things are (or not) progressing. The Funeral Director hasn't been paid, I haven't been re-imbursed £1000 for expenses I've incurred, no request has been made to value the house (the executor doesn't have access to the property) and it is now three months since my mum died. I believe that 6 months is a point at which HMRC can start charging interest. If I'm right, we're half way though this with no concrete proof that anything has been progressed.

Apart from writing emails asking "what';s the progress?" is there anything that can be done to get the executor backside in gear?

TonyMMM

SBTaxi wrote: »

. I believe that 6 months is a point at which HMRC can start charging interest.

Is the estate likely to be subject to inheritance tax ? If not you can forget the above.

6 months would be the absolute minimum for a solicitor to deal with any simple estate, and 12 months+ is not unusual, which is also why it is generally a bad idea to have a solicitor as an executor for most estates - being quite a simple task to do yourself in many cases.

You will need to speak to them and ask for an update on progress (whilst remembering every phone call, email or letter will be chargeable).

If you arranged the funeral, then you are the one the FD will ultimately come chasing for payment, so you should at least get that settled by them asap. The usual method is to present the FD's invoice to the deceased's bank who will arrange to pay it direct - but if the solicitor has taken everything over and the accounts are now frozen that may make that difficult now.

SBTaxi

Hi TonyMMM,
thanks for a quick reply.

TonyMMM wrote: »

Is the estate likely to be subject to inheritance tax ?

Yes

TonyMMM wrote: »

6 months would be the absolute minimum for a solicitor to deal with any simple estate, and 12 months+ is not unusual, which is also why it is generally a bad idea to have a solicitor as an executor for most estates - being quite a simple task to do yourself in many cases.

Executor was named as the solicitor in the will - so no choice there sadly.

TonyMMM wrote: »

The usual method is to present the FD's invoice to the deceased's bank who will arrange to pay it direct - but if the solicitor has taken everything over and the accounts are now frozen that may make that difficult now.

We've had three different answers to this one, with the replies from the executor in chronological order being :-
I (executor) need to chase the bank up on that
The bank will be releasing the funds in the next couple of days
I need to give the bank the information

Which does not inspire much confidence!

It isn't the financial side of things that bothers me (or my siblings) about this - we just want to get this over and done with, then get on with the rest of our lives - suspect most people in our position feel the same.

AnotherJoe

SBTaxi wrote: »

Although I'm fairly sure that it's a common problem I'm experiencing, I couldn't find any threads relating to my question. Namely, what, if anything, can be done to get an executor of a will's bum into action.

<snip>

Apart from writing emails asking "what';s the progress?" is there anything that can be done to get the executor backside in gear?

Solicitors being extremely slow as executors is not at all uncommon, the reverse would be true. All i can suggest is be the squeaky wheel. Emails dont squeak but phone calls and letters and visits do.



List what you want specifically done, such as funeral services paid and demand its done.

Brynsam

Completely understand how you feel, but many people who have never been executors simply don't grasp how long the whole process can (and often must) take. Once you get into the mindset of blaming the executor for what you see as being excessively slow, it is really hard to get out of that spiral.

Tax is indeed payable at the end of the sixth month following the death, but the cash has to come from somewhere - and probate won't be granted until the tax is paid. It is less than 3 months from your mum's death, so you aren't going to be feeling great - but believing all would be well if the executor did things as the speed you'd prefer isn't realistic.

Draw up a list of things you believe are the most pressing (e.g. paying you £1,000, paying the funeral director) and go and see the solicitor if you can, assuming you are within reasonable travelling distance. Agree the priorities and timeframe and also, as pleasantly as you can(!), ask how best you can assist in progress if timescales slip. Follow up after the meeting with an e-mail confirming what has been agreed.

An executor is not your enemy, so don't turn this into a battle. The solicitor has a tough enough job sorting out an estate without being blamed for the reality of how much time the whole process will need.

Yorkshireman99

Brynsam wrote: »

Completely understand how you feel, but many people who have never been executors simply don't grasp how long the whole process can (and often must) take. Once you get into the mindset of blaming the executor for what you see as being excessively slow, it is really hard to get out of that spiral.

Tax is indeed payable at the end of the sixth month following the death, but the cash has to come from somewhere - and probate won't be granted until the tax is paid. It is less than 3 months from your mum's death, so you aren't going to be feeling great - but believing all would be well if the executor did things as the speed you'd prefer isn't realistic.

Draw up a list of things you believe are the most pressing (e.g. paying you £1,000, paying the funeral director) and go and see the solicitor if you can, assuming you are within reasonable travelling distance. Agree the priorities and timeframe and also, as pleasantly as you can(!), ask how best you can assist in progress if timescales slip. Follow up after the meeting with an e-mail confirming what has been agreed.

An executor is not your enemy, so don't turn this into a battle. The solicitor has a tough enough job sorting out an estate without being blamed for the reality of how much time the whole process will need.

The OP also eds to understand that the executor has to wait a minimum of six months to se that there are now claims from dependent relatives under the Family provisions legislation. Having estblished the estate value and as part of the Probate application HMR& C have to be paid. If HMR&C are satified they will release the will to the Probate Office who will issue the grant of probate. Then the executor will issue the statutory notices in the London Gazette and wait about seven weeks to se if there are any unpaid credtors. Then they can distribute the estate.

Dox

Given how recently you have been bereaved, you probably aren't at your most pro-active, but there is nothing to stop you trying to help things along. Family members have ready access to information (much of it based on simple prior knowledge) a solicitor won't have. Providing this in an easy to digest format such as a list of bank accounts, any savings/shares, other assets etc could be the most constructive way to get matters moving. An executor doesn't necessarily need access to a property - the valuation will be done by local estate agents/valuers, and if it's a fairly standard property surrounded by similar properties, they don't always go inside - but why not check specifically on whether you need to provide keys to someone.

Remember too that your solicitor is dealing with parties such as the bank who aren't always noted for speedy and sympathetic responses. Each time he chases, he clocks up extra fees - it's a balancing act between keeping down the costs to avoid complaints from beneficiaries, and getting the job done.

Even apparently simple estates can be quite difficult to wind up, the more so where IHT is payable. How will payment be funded?

SBTaxi

Yorkshireman99 wrote: »

The OP also eds to understand that the executor has to wait a minimum of six months to se that there are now claims from dependent relatives under the Family provisions legislation.

Wasn't aware of that - thanks for the ifo.

With my mu in law dying a couple of years ago, and my dad a couple of years before that, I know that some stages will take time

SevenOfNine

The bank a/c being 'frozen' won't delay the FD bill from being paid promptly, it's more likely the solicitor hasn't forwarded it to the bank yet. Barclays paid the outstanding half, & reimbursed my mother for the half she'd paid within a week of being handed the invoices. Lloyds equally as fast, all from a 'frozen' accounts.

Solicitors handling estates don't seem to move higher than second gear with any of it, dawdling their way to obtaining probate, then 2 1/2 months added on from placing the advert in London Gazette (& locally if property is involved).

To be fair they are working on other things, but at the same time they are charging a fair bit, I've never seen anyone on here saying "boy the solicitor acting as executor for grannies estate was FAST".

As laymen we've done this 3 times now, 2 of them with property to be sold. Each time wrapped up (including houses sold) in 4 months & funds distributed.

However, none were subject to IHT (which may add to the timescale) & we chose not to place the advisory advert in the London Gazette - but I'm not saying that's a wise decision, depends how much you can be totally confident regarding the deceased (creditors, unknown beneficiaries coming knocking, & a good point from YM99 #6 etc), so each to their own choice on that one, but not so for a solicitor.

We put the houses on the market "subject to probate", so that was underway. Bear in mind that once probate is granted you'll have 6 months council tax exemption, after which the estate will be liable for charge.

Afraid with solicitors named in a will as executors, beneficiaries ordinarily have to have an awful lot of patience, but be mindful that chasing/checking too often could land you with a bigger bill at the end (if inheritance is large this may not matter of course).

Beneficiaries can also be the biggest pain in the @ rse to an executor, it can take time, the inheritance is a lovely windfall, & patience is a virtue!

Tealblue

SBTaxi wrote: »

Wasn't aware of that - thanks for the ifo.

Probably because it isn't accurate. Claimants under the 1975 Act have six months from the date of the grant of probate to stake their claim (which I think is where the erroneous assumption has been drawn, probably based on some well-meaning but amateur googling!) - and then another four months to serve proceedings on the other parties, so the 'best practice' guidance is actually 10 months - but that isn't a 'legal' requirement.

If the executor is satisfied that it is safe to distribute the estate, they can proceed to do so as soon as probate has been granted, but obviously a professional executor is likely to err on the side of caution. It's something to bear in mind for people when deciding who to nominate as executors.

Brynsam

Tealblue wrote: »

If the executor is satisfied that it is safe to distribute the estate, they can proceed to do so as soon as probate has been granted, but obviously a professional executor is likely to err on the side of caution. It's something to bear in mind for people when deciding who to nominate as executors.

Quite. If the executors get it wrong, any claim is brought against the executors personally. Where the executors are also beneficiaries, they will often be willing to take the risk - usually quite a small one - of distributing the estate much more quickly, since the worst that could happen if they have to hand back some of their inheritance.

A professional executor has no such immediate recourse to estate funds if wrongly paid out, hence the reluctance to do things other than exactly 'by the book' - which is why solicitors often have a somewhat unfair reputation for being 'slow' in winding up estates where they are the executor.