State Funding / Benefits & Invoicing After Death ?

jdybnsn

Could some one offer some clarity on the following situation please ?


MIL sadly passed away after being in a care home. She was part funded by her council and part by her self comprising of her state pension/benefits and very small widows pension. Just a small amount remained in her account for any of her small incidental costs.


Upon her death, naturally her state & private pension was stopped, and those which could not be stopped in time, we received (as executors) a request for repayment of them - fair enough.


However, a large deduction from her bank account, by the council (for her half of the care home bill), was made a few weeks after her death. We also received a further invoice, a few weeks later for a further amount, as it appears that the council had something of a time lag in invoicing for the collection of these payments, by approximately 2 months after the care provision was actually given.


Is it common to have a gap in funding such as this to be met ?


I assume it would be no use asking the council for a reassessment of her funding at this time, considering her income has been since her death has been exactly nil, ....and given her contribution is/was based on means testing ?!?


Just wanted to clarify that these invoices were still due after her death, presumably to be paid from what little there is left in her estate ?

Keep_pedalling

My mother was in a similar situation and was billed in arrears although it was only 4 weeks. As these were bills for services she received while still alive they are debts owed by the estate, which will have to pay them providing their is enough left after funeral costs.

If, once reasonable funeral costs have been met, there is not enough left to pay the final invoice in full then her estate is insolvent, then you will need to write to them informing them of the situation. You are not responsible for paying for any shortfall.

jdybnsn

Thanks - we are resigned to paying her outstanding bill if necessary, but just feel a bit annoyed at the lag in the invoices, and such swift removal of income....which if you think about it should never become that far apart, given her circumstances (which had not changed for several years).


Her estate will be small so we don't need probate ....can anyone point us in the direction of some information on going through the "small estates" route ? Will swearing an oath and/or lodging any forms still be necessary ? If so could someone kindly give us a quick point plan ?


There are only 2 beneficiaries (husband & his brother) and they get on fine.

Yorkshireman99

jdybnsn wrote: »

Could some one offer some clarity on the following situation please ?


MIL sadly passed away after being in a care home. She was part funded by her council and part by her self comprising of her state pension/benefits and very small widows pension. Just a small amount remained in her account for any of her small incidental costs.


Upon her death, naturally her state & private pension was stopped, and those which could not be stopped in time, we received (as executors) a request for repayment of them - fair enough.


However, a large deduction from her bank account, by the council (for her half of the care home bill), was made a few weeks after her death. We also received a further invoice, a few weeks later for a further amount, as it appears that the council had something of a time lag in invoicing for the collection of these payments, by approximately 2 months after the care provision was actually given.


Is it common to have a gap in funding such as this to be met ?


I assume it would be no use asking the council for a reassessment of her funding at this time, considering her income has been since her death has been exactly nil, ....and given her contribution is/was based on means testing ?!?


Just wanted to clarify that these invoices were still due after her death, presumably to be paid from what little there is left in her estate ?

How were the Council able. to take the money. Her bank account should have been blocked as soon as she died. Was this not done? The care fees do not take priority over funeral cost.

jdybnsn

Yorkshireman99 wrote: »

How were the Coucilable to take the money. Her bank account should have been blocked as soon as she died. Was this not done? The care fees do not take priority over funeral cost.

The bank were informed, but it seemed to be a while before their bereavement team acted to freeze the account, as my husband had been instructed to attend a branch with his ID and a copy of the will (which he first had to obtain) - he was unaware this was of any urgency so it was a couple of weeks after the funeral.

Flugelhorn

provided the money is just in bank / BS accounts and under a certain amount (varies by bank etc but RBS was at least 20k) then they need death cert and sight of the will to release the funds, if no will then they will release to NOK.

Shares and Premium bonds over a rather lower amount need more forms etc

Keep_pedalling

jdybnsn wrote: »

Thanks - we are resigned to paying her outstanding bill if necessary, but just feel a bit annoyed at the lag in the invoices, and such swift removal of income....which if you think about it should never become that far apart, given her circumstances (which had not changed for several years).

Are there any insurance policies to claim?

Her estate will be small so we don't need probate ....can anyone point us in the direction of some information on going through the "small estates" route ? Will swearing an oath and/or lodging any forms still be necessary ? If so could someone kindly give us a quick point plan ?


There are only 2 beneficiaries (husband & his brother) and they get on fine.

With a small estate like this there is little you need to do, apart from making an appointment with her bank to wind up her accounts. You need to take in a copy of her death certificate, her will, and some ID to prove who you are. They will get you to sign an indemnity form, and they will then release the money to you.

They are no official forms you need to fill in, regards winding up the estate.

Voyager2002

jdybnsn wrote: »

The bank were informed, but it seemed to be a while before their bereavement team acted to freeze the account, as my husband had been instructed to attend a branch with his ID and a copy of the will (which he first had to obtain) - he was unaware this was of any urgency so it was a couple of weeks after the funeral.

Once the bank had been informed, they should not have allowed that payment. I suggest that you make a formal complaint and ask them to claw back the money.

Keep_pedalling

Voyager2002 wrote: »

Once the bank had been informed, they should not have allowed that payment. I suggest that you make a formal complaint and ask them to claw back the money.

i am not sure if they will do that from a phone call alone, otherwise anyone could freeze anyones accounts with a simple phone call. My mums account was only shutdown the day I went into the bank, although that was only 3 days after she died.

I would only be looking to claw back any money if the estate was insolvent, otherwise you are just creating a lot work for no good reason.

Yorkshireman99

jdybnsn wrote: »

The bank were informed, but it seemed to be a while before their bereavement team acted to freeze the account, as my husband had been instructed to attend a branch with his ID and a copy of the will (which he first had to obtain) - he was unaware this was of any urgency so it was a couple of weeks after the funeral.

You need to press the bank on this as it is a fundamental error. The team should have made it clear to your husband aware of the urgency. The money should be clawed back until it can be stablishrf what other debts and assets there are.

AnotherJoe

Yorkshireman99 wrote: »

How were the Council able. to take the money. Her bank account should have been blocked as soon as she died. Was this not done? The care fees do not take priority over funeral cost.

We had similar with my mother, DWP withdrew overpaid benefits* even though the account was frozen. Apparently some government departments, and i dont know if council counts as one, are able to do this.

So it would be more accurate to say the account is only accessible to government Depts A,B,C etc, rather than the impression they give which is that its actually "solidly" frozen to all and sundry.

* no issues with that but they'd also seperately and previously asked us to pay those sums by cheque which means we paid twice. So now the fun of trying to rewind that Still ongoing.

Lesson is, if asked to refund, wait a couple of months and see what they claw back anyway.