Euro Car Parks Popla Appeal

nick_968

Other thoughts:

1. The ANPR records a period of 24 minutes. Well within the 2 hours allowed for patients to park. The issue here is that they claim the car was not registered in the console in the clinic. A genuine error due to the misleading signage. Is there any other angle here. I assume it falls outside of any grace period? Do they need to prove that the vehicle was not recorded on their system? Do they need to prove the accuracy of their ANPR system time records?

2. There are no photos provided of the vehicle actually parked - just entering and leaving. Do they need to prove it was parked?

Coupon-mad

Do they need to prove that the vehicle was not recorded on their system?

Yes, and some firms do, with a 'white list look-up'.

Do they need to prove the accuracy of their ANPR system time records?

Nope.

There are no photos provided of the vehicle actually parked - just entering and leaving. Do they need to prove it was parked?

Nope.

nick_968

Is it worth me going back to the site and taking specific photos to support the signage argument?

nick_968

Also is it worth attaching proof of purchase at the clinic as evidence of being a genuine visitor or does that get in the way of the other arguments?

Coupon-mad

nick_968 wrote: »

Is it worth me going back to the site and taking specific photos to support the signage argument?

Yes, not close-up though, look to show a lack of signs/no entrance sign that can be seen by a driver on arrival, whole bays and corners left unsigned, etc.

is it worth attaching proof of purchase at the clinic as evidence of being a genuine visitor

No, POPLA will not consider that and there would be a danger of implying who was driving.

nick_968

Ok - I have the photos of the signage and its not looking so good for ECP in my opinion. Can I post them here or is that not allowed?

Redx

not allowed

but you can host them on tinypic and add links

nick_968

Appeal submitted. I now have what looks like a fairly bog standard response from ECP where it also references their solicitors Gladstones. It does appear to have what is an attempt at satisfying the landholders authority. No detailed response to my lengthy appeal re the signage just standard stuff.

Can I post the text of the response here?

waamo

You can if you want.

nick_968

Euro Car Parks Reponse:

This location is managed by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) technology which takes a picture of the vehicle entering and exiting the site, these pictures are timed and therefore the duration of the stay can be calculated. All vehicle registration numbers are then matched against the data produced by the various means of paying for parking and a list of registration numbers where no payment has been made or where the motorist has stayed longer than the period paid is produced. After requesting vehicle keeper details from the DVLA, a Notice to keeper is sent to the keepers of the vehicles on this list. As a consequence at ANPR locations there will be no PCN issued to the windscreen neither will there be photographic evidence of the windscreen supplied in operator evidence packs.
Parking Charge Notice xxxxxx was issued to vehicle xxxxx for breach of terms and conditions Your vehicle was not authorised to park at the xxx car park. This car park operates a 24 hour ANPR + Authorised vehicles only.
xxxx has appealed to POPLA stating the below:
Inadequate Signage
Contradictory Signage
No evidence of Landowner Authority
Failure to comply with the Data Protection Act
The operator has not shown that the individual who it is pursuing is in fact liable for the charge
Euro Car Parks would like to respond to the points raised with the following:
Section 18.3 of the British Parking Associations (BPA) code of practice explains that signs must be conspicuous and legible and written in intelligible language, so that they are easy to see, read and understand. Signage on site is clear, when parking on private land it is the drivers responsibility to read the signage displayed and parked accordance with the terms and conditions as stated. Euro Car Parks have provided photographic evidence showing that the appellant remained at the site for 24 minutes (Figure 1)
The signage clearly states the terms and conditions of parking, all drivers are required to adhere to the terms and conditions on site. Therefore xxxx should have regsitered his vehicle registration within the Health Centre (Figure 2)
Signage on site is clear, when parking on private land it is the drivers responsibility to read the signage displayed and parked accordance with the rules and regulations as stated
The signage clearly states the rules and regulations of parking, all drivers are required to register their vehicle registration via the console located in the health centre.
The contract (signage) clearly states the extra charges are that the driver will incur and have to pay if they decide to break the contract terms for example, by parking longer than the time paid for or exceeding the maximum time limit applicable.
The car park in question is on private land and upon entering such land vehicles are subject to the rules and regulations of parking as shown on the signage. This signage quite clearly states that if your vehicle is in breach of the rules and regulations of the car park then a parking charge notice (PCN) will be issued.
On entry to private land it is the responsibility of the driver to check for signage and ensure that your vehicle has been correctly parked. Any vehicles found not adhering to the signage will be issued with a parking charge notice (PCN).
Euro Car Parks can confirm that the notice has been issued under contract law !!!8211; the signage on site is clear and when parking on private land it is the responsibility of the driver to read aforementioned signage and park in accordance with the T&CS displayed.
Please see Figure 3 where I can confirm that ECP PCNs are POFA compliant
Any form of parking ticket or notice is issued under the law of trespass and Contract Law. A driver who is invited (or chooses) to park on private land and use the car parking facilities and pays a fee/s does so under a contract (signage) with the car park operator. The parking contract sets out the terms that apply to the parking service, including the price.
C1 MB
The contract (signage) clearly states the extra charges are that the driver will incur and have to pay if they decide to break the contract terms for example, by parking longer than the time paid for or exceeding the maximum time limit applicable.
With regards to the reference to Pre-Estimate of Loss/breach of consumer contracts 1999. Please be advised that the Supreme Court has made judgement (04/11/15) that clearly sets out the issue of parking charge notices on private land (law of contract applies) and in particular pre-estimate of loss. The parking charge notice is enforceable on the basis that it protected a legitimate interest when the driver failed to adhere to the terms and conditions and was not extravagant, exorbitant nor unconscionable. The parking charge is not an unenforceable penalty and does not breach the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.
- Its the drivers responsibility to check the signage prior to leaving the vehicle on site.
- Contract Law Applies
According to BPA Code of Practise 13.4 car park operators should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended; before enforcement action is taken. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted; the grace period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes. I can confirm that Euro Car Parks have given xxxxx (note wrong name used here not even amended to the right person when doing the cut and paste) the suitable grace period of 10 minutes.
Euro Car Parks do not need to provide evidence of who was driving the vehicle, it is the registered keeper!!!8217;s responsibility to inform of the full name and address within 28 days beginning with the day after the notice was given. If the full amount remains unpaid, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (the Act), Euro Car Parks have the right subject of the Act to recover from the keeper of the vehicle at the time it was parked so much of that amount which remains unpaid.
Figure 4 is the agreement between ECP and Community Health Partnerships.
The signage on site is clear and as the driver it is the drivers responsibility to check and adhere to the terms of parking. xxxxx was parked at the car park for 24 minutes without registering his vehicle via the console on site.
Please see below; the vehicle registration xxxx was not authorised to park in the car park