Confusion over VAT for teaching

BeckyP1234

Hello

My head is spinning and my accountant doesn’t seem to know the answer

I’m a sole trader (self employed barrister) I’m registered for VAT. I’ve taken on some self employed freelance work at a university. I don’t think I have to charge VAT, my accountant and university are unsure.

I didn’t think I did because it’s a university anfh the course is one that is delivered as part of the degree.

Any thoughts or experiences welcome. I keep reading the VAT note and getting confused. The

Many thanks

martindow

I don't know the answer, but if your accountant is as ignorant as me I think I'd be looking to find someone else!

Have you called HMRC? I've found them to be very helpful in the past.

Aquamania

BeckyP1234 wrote: »

Hello

My head is spinning and my accountant doesn!!!8217;t seem to know the answer

I!!!8217;m a sole trader (self employed barrister) I!!!8217;m registered for VAT. I!!!8217;ve taken on some self employed freelance work at a university. I don!!!8217;t think I have to charge VAT, my accountant and university are unsure.

I didn!!!8217;t think I did because it!!!8217;s a university anfh the course is one that is delivered as part of the degree.

Any thoughts or experiences welcome. I keep reading the VAT note and getting confused. The

Many thanks

+1 for getting yourself a new accountant if they do not know the answer to this question, and presumably are not prepared to find you the answer, Miss

Have you consulted VAT Notice 701/30? (revised April 2017)

On a pragmatic approach, as you are selling your services in question to a University, it probably makes little difference if you do add the VAT as they will simply reclaim it if you do
... and as you indicate, there is no one there with the expertise to challenge you on applying VAT to your services supplied, if you did.

In your other professional duties, what is the usual process you would adopt to resolve difficulties where there is a difference of opinion between two parties?

In this instance it appears to be a case of BeckyP1234-v- The Rest of the World (who all plead ignorance)

Pennywise

martindow wrote: »

I don't know the answer, but if your accountant is as ignorant as me I think I'd be looking to find someone else!

No way that a general accountant can know everything to do with every tax. You wouldn't expect specialist cancer treatment from your GP would you? I'd far rather a service provider was honest and told me he didn't know than give me the wrong answer. VAT as regards teaching is a very specialist area - I've had clients like this and have taken specialist advice from two different consultants (I always get 2 opinions) and they've come out different - that's from 2 VAT specialists! So don't be too hard on your general accountant.

ceh209

Pennywise wrote: »

No way that a general accountant can know everything to do with every tax. You wouldn't expect specialist cancer treatment from your GP would you? I'd far rather a service provider was honest and told me he didn't know than give me the wrong answer. VAT as regards teaching is a very specialist area - I've had clients like this and have taken specialist advice from two different consultants (I always get 2 opinions) and they've come out different - that's from 2 VAT specialists! So don't be too hard on your general accountant.

No, but a GP would refer you to a cancer specialist. In this case the accountant doesn't appear to be trying to help at all.

Savvy_Sue

I'm astonished the university is willing to treat you as self-employed, tbh. If they put you on the payroll, even as a casual, the question would not arise.

00ec25

Aquamania wrote: »

On a pragmatic approach, as you are selling your services in question to a University, it probably makes little difference if you do add the VAT as they will simply reclaim it if you do

actually it would make a huge difference because, as OP appears to know, a University (ie education) is a partially exempt activity and therefore cannot simply claim back all VAT it is charged.

at the uni I used to work at we did indeed have an in house VAT expert who spent most of his time doing such partial exemption calculations

since whether you do or do not charge VAT is based on the type of taxable supply you make then the question is, as OP alludes to, down to what is he supplying ... eg: if he has been engaged as a contractor to deliver teaching then that is exempt. Teaching would include contact and some non contact time, but if his role is purely non contact admin/management then it is not exempt.

BeckyP1234

Thanks so much for everyone who took the time to reply.

I had seen the updated VAT notice but thanks for highlighting it.

The university aren’t saying definitively whether the work attracts VAT which wasn’t very helpful. They are saying though that fee I agreed was inclusive of VAT if VAT is indeed applicable

in fairness to them I signed that agreement but assumed my work wasn’t VAT applicable.

I was hoping that VAT wasn’t applicable as my rate is £75 per hour but if it has to be inclusive of VAT you can see that I don’t stand to make as much money.

What I wasn’t sure about was whether my work is private tuition as a sole trader (therefore exempt) or supply of services to students at university which is exempt

Or if I’ve just made a bad deal.

Perhaps a call to HMRC will clarify!

BeckyP1234

I should just clarify my work is purely teaching so I lead seminars and give lectures all students are postgraduates