Flat for sale with tenant

smousie

My friend has recently been to view a flat that's up for sale. The person who answered the door turned out to be the tenant, the fact that there was a tenant wasn't mentioned in the For Sale advert. There was no estate agent in sight, they obviously expected the tenant to show buyers around. The tenant was asking if my friend's going to be his new landlord, and seemed annoyed when my friend said he wanted to buy a place to live in himself, not to rent out.

The tenant obligingly pointed out all the faults with the flat: the noisy plumbing, knackered door that needed replacing, crumbling plaster and flaking bath, etc. The property has a parking space at the rear, but the tenant said they don't park there because driving round the potholed back lane to the parking spot has damaged the chassis of their car, so rather than damage the car again they park around the corner in a neighbouring street. No other cars appeared to be parked there and the road was a mess so this appears to be true.

The tenant said he's on a rolling contract and would have to be given at least 2 months notice to move out, but he doesn't intend to play ball as its inconvenient to move at present; he intends to stay as long as possible and evicting him could take some time. My friend was concerned that if he bought the flat he might have to wait for months to get the tenant evicted, or even worse he might have to handle it himself once the sale had gone through.

Would buying this flat be worth the hassle? Would a tenant in the flat put you off buying it? Should my friend simply look for another flat with no tenant? What would you think if the estate agent didn't even bother to show you around themselves?

silvercar

If your friend is buying with vacant possession then it would be the current landlords responsibility to ensure that the property is vacant. His solicitor will presumably guide him to not exchange until the property is vacant to avoid putting the landlord in breach of contract with the buyer. (This would occur if the tenant wasn't out on the day of completion.)

Sounds to me that the tenant wants to stay and so is deliberately pointing out faults and telling you he is going to be difficult. I bet if your friend said they were looking for a buy-to-let they would find a totally different attitude.

Lazy estate agent clearly not doing his job.

millymollymandy2K7

My landlord has put my flat on the market. So far there has been 1 viewer but my landlord called me first to arrange a suitable time for them to view and was here when they arrived (I was also in property at the time) so he could show them round and answer any questions they had. I have not yet had my notice to quit - think landlord plans to wait until he has buyer rather than lose out on my rent for a month or two - but under my lease he just requires to give me 1 months notice.

guppy

millymollymandy2K7 wrote: »

My landlord has put my flat on the market. So far there has been 1 viewer but my landlord called me first to arrange a suitable time for them to view and was here when they arrived (I was also in property at the time) so he could show them round and answer any questions they had. I have not yet had my notice to quit - think landlord plans to wait until he has buyer rather than lose out on my rent for a month or two - but under my lease he just requires to give me 1 months notice.

Hope you're getting a discount on your rent for your trouble

smousie

From searching online I've discovered that legally the tenant has to receive 2 months notice from a rent date, which is likely to be the first of the month, so the total notice period could be 2-3 months depending on what time of month the flat was bought. Then the tenant could try to claim the notice was issued wrongly and start from scratch with a new notice, or refuse to move and have to be taken to court, etc, which could take months. And if the tenant is going to be difficult he could damage the property through spite or something.

In any case it looks bad when neither the estate agent nor the owner bothers to show viewers around, leaving viewings to be done by an unwilling tenant. My friend asked the tenant why he didn't buy the property himself if he wanted to stay there, and the tenant said it required too many costly repairs and was overpriced, on a 100% mortgage the repayments would be up to £300-400 more than he was currently paying in rent, in fact the interest alone would be at least £150 more than the current rent.

HugoSP

As others have said, exchange would not or should not take place until the tenant is out.

I must admit it seems short sighted of the tenant to try to be difficult. Tenants need good references and when he is eventually outed (he will be) he will need to rely on a good reference, that he will not have. This will make it even harder for him to find somewhere else.

millymollymandy2K7

guppy wrote: »

Hope you're getting a discount on your rent for your trouble

I did think of that but as yet haven't mentioned it - I'm just too nice for my own good lol.Landlord did ask me if I fancied buying the flat but like the tenent in OP I feel the asking price plus the work that needs done makes it unfeasible, but fine to rent as the responsibility to do the work belongs to someone else.

Lazy_Runner

Just be glad that the tenant didn't move in before 1989 (I think). Then you get into fair rent issues and it is almost impossible to kick somebody out.

I have seen flats advertised in Chelsea for about £120k but with a sitting tenant whose agreement began before 1989. As an owner you have let the continue living there, picking up a pittance for the rent. But once the tenant (and possibly anybody they assign to be the subsequent tenant - I think) moves out, you will have a property worth a fortune.

franklee

silvercar wrote: »

Sounds to me that the tenant wants to stay and so is deliberately pointing out faults and telling you he is going to be difficult. I bet if your friend said they were looking for a buy-to-let they would find a totally different attitude.

But if the faults the tenant pointed out were genuine then how is that being difficult?

I've been in a similar position when prospective buyers called at the door. They were a lovely couple, just married, and called to ask if there were any issues like with the management company. Well there were, it was a war zone with parties suing each other, so what on earth was I supposed to say? I just said as I tenant I did not feel comfortable commenting but that they absolutely must speak to the freeholder directly and suggested how they could contact him. Needless to say they disappeared never to be heard of again!

I'd suggest any landlord think twice before selling with the tenant in-situ, unless selling as an investment property, as the tenant's loyalties could be elsewhere ... It is not the tenant's job to cover up for the landlord.

wherediditallgo

I agree, franklee. When my cousin was privately renting, her landlord was the sort to be very slow about dealing with repairs etc but would notice if the rent was minutes late. :rolleyes: She decided to tell him she was moving out, but just days before she did he told her he was going to be selling up & would be giving her notice once he had a buyer. She was going travelling but hadn't got any fixed travel date in mind, so she decided she might as well stay where she was as it was cheaper than the going rate for the area. She then found he expected her to show people around the flat for him with no discount on the rent, so she decided to be polite but honest - she pointed out all the repairs/work that needed doing (leaking taps, damp patches, draughty windows & how cold the flat was in winter as a result etc) & how long she'd been waiting for them to be done, but was amiable throughout & didn't directly slate the landlord as a person. When her landlord found out what she'd said, he wasn't happy but she told him that if he wanted to sell the property he should do exactly that - sell it himself instead of expecting her to potentially make herself homeless by doing it for him. As it turned out, she decided to put off travelling for another year, & she was in the flat for nearly 9 months more, because the landlord didn't want to lose her rent by evicting her before the property was sold, but was too tight to spend money on an agent or take time out to deal with viewings himself, so no-one was interested in buying once she'd had her say. He had to accept that he either had to handle the viewings himself, get an agent involved, do the repairs to give my cousin less to tell prospective buyers, offer her a discount on the rent to be more amenable/keep schtum or just wait for the right buyer to come along. Him being him, he took the option to just wait, so that's what he ended up doing.

Landlords can't have it both ways. A tenant is going to be concerned about having to find somewhere else to live. You can't expect them to in effect promote your property & put themselves out on the street, yet continue to pay you full rent until you find the buyer whose offer you like. If you want your property sold, then sell it yourself with whatever costs that incurs rather than expect & trust your tenant to do it for free. It's going to cost you money whichever way you do it.