Loft conversion and house renovation costs

Blogger

Hi
I have a three bedroom victorian mid terraced house that is in a poor state. Everything needs changing apart from a boiler, wooden floor boards and a staircase. The house is in LCOL area in London. To renovate it fully (including plumbing and rewiring) as well as adding the dormer loft room with bathroom I've been quoted £27,000 labour costs and 2 months timeframe. The costs include plumbing and rewiring with 4 labourers working on site. I will pay for the materials of my choosing, scaffolding costs and I will engage architect & surveyors as needed.

1. Is this quote fair?
2. How much should I expect materials and fixtures to cost? I aiming for a mid range kitchen and bathroom suites.

Many thanks.

Doozergirl

How can someone quote if you haven't had the architect and surveyors in yet?

It sounds dangerously cheap for a full renovation and loft conversion in London. How does anyone know what specification you're working to if you don't?

Recipe for disaster.

glasgowdan

It sounds like all they've done is quote a day rate and multiplied it up by an estimated 2 months. This time frame is flexible. It's not a quote.

In terms of rates it works out at £3k per week, or £150/day per man, which is low.

Blogger

Doozergirl
They came to the house and spent about an hour while I explained room by room what I needed to be done. Since they do not know the exact specifications are I got a quote for the labour only. Is this unusual?

glasgowdan
They seem to do lots of similar renovations in my area which has low average income for London. Some builders refused to quote after hearing a postcode knowing that it would be low. What is a more realistic price?

Doozergirl

So you've bought nine weeks of labour. Cheap labour with no resposibility taken as there is nothing in their budget for that.

It's not a quote for the job. It's £27k for nine weeks labour, not a finished project within a timescale. I'm not sure where qualified trades like gas engineers and electricians sit in there.

As long as you know what you're getting yourself into. You have no guarantee that £27k gets you to the end. They will walk off site when the day rate runs out. This is your project with your name on it, no one elses. Quality control is your area, delays caused by not being prepared are your problem. You haven't yet commissioned drawings and calcs for the loft conversion and you are also in charge of building control here.

Sounds like a great deal for the builders.

Blogger

Doozergirl
This is the case here. I discussed with them the contract and they are happy to sign it to complete the job not just work for 2 months and walk away. They have done comparable jobs in the area for a similar price. I understand that the quote is on the low side for London labour but nothing would get renovated in my area if it was much higher because people just would not be able to afford. What is the ratio of labour to materials for a standard renovation and loft conversion?

Doozergirl

So you've written down exactly what the job entails and the detailed specification that it's done to? If you don't specify, they have nothing to stick to so they can do what they like. How do you apportion payments to protect yourself that the entire job is done in time? You can't, because it's based on time, not the price of various jobs that can be ticked off along the way.

Sounds insane to me. No professional has dictated what needs to happen to your loft so how can they possibly know how long it takes? Nine weeks sounds very short for a complete, comprehensive renovation and loft conversion.

Materials should be less than labour but your labour is low. This is not a way to price a job. It is highly unprofessional and you are dicing with danger if you think you are handing responsibilty to these people. You are not. You are paying labour only, no materials. It goes hand in hand that you are therefore the contractor and project manager on this job. The risk is all yours.

No one who knows what they are doing works for less than £150 a day. Qualified trades are more expensive anywhere.