Bike insurance - won't repair or pay enough to replace.

CazyDee

Someone dropped their bike onto my immaculate yellow GSXR-600 and damaged most of one side. They accepted liability but their insurers won't pay for the repairs - they've written it off. They've offered a settlement figure but not enough for me to go out and buy the same bike in a similar condition. I've only got 3rd party insurance so no legal assistance.

My gsxr was immaculate - K1/01 plate, 5000 dry miles only. It was my pride and joy.

Not only won't they pay enough for me to replace my bike, they said I have to pay the bill for the mechanics who inspected and then stored my bike - £500.

They say that the colour is irrelevant and won't affect the settlement offer.
There are only 7 yellow gsxrs for sale on the biketrader and mcn websites.
2 of those are in worse condition than mine - with scratched fairing etc.
and 5 of those are about £700 more than they've offered.

I don't know what to do. They said that if I'm not happy with their offer then I should instruct my solicitors to contact them and we'll go through legal channels.

I just want my bike back - like it was - before it got knocked over.
I'm kicking myself for not having paid the extra £600 bennetts wanted for comprehensive cover - at least now I'd have legal help.

And here's the killer... I'd only owned the bike for 3 weeks!

Any help or advice on this would be so very much appreciated!

Horace

I would get a second opinion from your own insurers regardless of the fact that you only have Third Party insurance. Are you a member of the RAC or something like? If so contact their legal services it is free, the number will be on your membership card.

Uhm, I don't see why you should pay their mechanics for looking at and storing your bike either after all it was their client who couldn't control his machine.

Try contacting trading standards or even the association of british insurers.

Good luck.

BTW I am not an expert in such matters but this is what I would do if it were my bike

gbell

I hope you took pictures of the bike before it went off to the mechanics because when i got my bike back from them it was much worse than when it went in!!!

You need to get some legal advice i think

foggytown

Well, here's what I would do in your place:

1. Get written or verbal quotes from dealers as to what your bike would have been worth on their forecourt BEFORE it was damaged. Get three quotes and average them. That should be about the market value of your bike.
2. Contact the Insurers in writing and demand they respond with their reasoning for the settlement offered. Also, what do they think was the value of the bike before the accident and based on what? What is the salvage value now?
2. If no joy then file a small claims action in county court. You can do it online through www.moneyclaim.gov.uk The insurer will have to defend this for their client and you can load your claim to include lost time from work, a rental vehicle during repairs, etc. That alone may shake them loose.
4. If no improved offers then go through with the action. Now they have to stand in front of a judge and explain to the vourt the basis for their offer.

FoggyTown

mattymoo

foggytown wrote: »

Well, here's what I would do in your place:

1. Get written or verbal quotes from dealers as to what your bike would have been worth on their forecourt BEFORE it was damaged. Get three quotes and average them. That should be about the market value of your bike.

Market value is what you would pay in a private sale. Dealer sales include their profit element. You are on the right lines though, just need to find 3 private sellers (sounds like the OP has already done this) and find out the final price realised on their bikes.

You could also commision an independent motor engineers report. Cost is normally £100-£200 but recoverable if it results in a higher offer.

Mechanics recovery and storage prices are recoverable although you do have a common law duty to mitigate your loss. Say storage is racking up at £20 a day. The insurers inspect and state bike is a write off by end of week 3. You would be expected to move it to cheaper storage within a week or two of then.

Note, common law is a basic tenet of the English legal system, not an insurance clause.

CazyDee

Blimey!
Thanks guys.
Sorry to hear about your bike gbell, I'm glad to say that I did take lots of pictures before the bike was taken away.
Horace - I'll take your advice and call the AA - see what they say.

The bikes a yellow k1 gsxr600 with just over 5000 miles on the clock.
Its also got a full service history.
They said the retail value of the bike is £3370
They gave me a salvage value was rated at 24.5% so they offered me £2544
The repairers quoted £2995
The repairers also said that I would have to pay £500 for storage, inspection etc and then claim that back from Hastings Direct (the 3rd party's insurers).

I've searched and searched online but there's nothing online like my bike for the money. Hastings Direct say that I can get a blue one for £3370
Or... I could get the one bike online that's up for about £2600 - its the same, colour, make and model etc. They don't seem to understand that a bike restricted to 33bhp isn't the same as my 600!

Bennetts, my insurers told me to call 4thDimension (the repairers) they gave me the number. If these are the guys who Bennetts (a specific bike insurer) recommend then how is it that their fees are unacceptable to Hastings Direct in this instance. 4th Dimension process 100s of bike insurance jobs every month. Surely insurers must have to pay these kinds of fees all the time?

foggytown

mattymoo wrote: »

Market value is what you would pay in a private sale. Dealer sales include their profit element. You are on the right lines though, just need to find 3 private sellers (sounds like the OP has already done this) and find out the final price realised on their bikes.

Sorry, but I disagree. Market value is what it costs to buy a vehicle of (as closely as possible) like kind and quality to the one that was damaged/destroyed. There is no provision in tort law that it has to come from a private seller, much though insurers might like that to be the case.

It is similar to the common (and erroneous) belief that your own insurer only owes you the car's trade price if a total loss. You aren't a car dealer so you can't buy cars for trade prices. You have to pay front court prices. Nor do they owe you "book value". That is only a guideline and book values can be wrong.

FoggyTown

CazyDee

Thanks for that foggytown.
I can't find anything like mine for under £4000.
I've asked them to revise their offer but they won't budge.

mattymoo

foggytown wrote: »

Sorry, but I disagree. Market value is what it costs to buy a vehicle of (as closely as possible) like kind and quality to the one that was damaged/destroyed. There is no provision in tort law that it has to come from a private seller, much though insurers might like that to be the case.

Sorry but you will have a long wait for dealer prices. This has been discussed at length on these forums before.

Supposing I damage your leather coat. Do you think I owe you a new coat or what that coat is worth, allowing for age, wear and tear. I'll give you a clue, its the latter.

Same as if I work for a removal company and drop your 10 yr old CRT tv. English law requires me to compensate you for the value of that TV (less than £20 in real terms) - not what it costs you to go out and buy another.

All I am required to do is put you back in the same financial position you were in before the accident. That is what it would cost me to go out and replace your bike / coat / tv with one of the same type / quality. It does not require me to pay top whack at a forecourt.

There is some useful info in this article but ultimately unusable since the ombudsman is only involved in policyholder / insurer disputes. This is simply a claim in the tort of negligence against a third party who happens to be insured.
Link here - http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/22/issue-22-motorinsurance.htm

foggytown

mattymoo wrote: »

Sorry but you will have a long wait for dealer prices. This has been discussed at length on these forums before.

Supposing I damage your leather coat. Do you think I owe you a new coat or what that coat is worth, allowing for age, wear and tear. I'll give you a clue, its the latter.

Same as if I work for a removal company and drop your 10 yr old CRT tv. English law requires me to compensate you for the value of that TV (less than £20 in real terms) - not what it costs you to go out and buy another.

You read but you don't understand. Nowhere did I say anything about "new for old", did I? No, I said an item of like kind & quality. You should know that includes condition, age. If I can find a comparable coat at a second hand shop then that's what I would expect to be reimbursed or, as we in the trade say, indemnified. If the third party insurer isn't happy with that, then THEY can chase around and see if they can find another comparable used coat cheaper.

All I am required to do is put you back in the same financial position you were in before the accident. That is what it would cost me to go out and replace your bike / coat / tv with one of the same type / quality. It does not require me to pay top whack at a forecourt.
[/quote]

I don't know the reason for your confusion but let me try to explain by example. Let's say that the OP can't find a bike for sale in private hands or that the private bikes available are in poor condition, much higher mileage, etc. etc. Now let's assume that there are one or more available from dealers which are more expensive but much closer matches to the OP's bike. Which value should be used? I'll give you a clue, it's the latter.

The Insurer in this case is playing a typical game: you don't like the offer? sue us! But in this case it will be their insured who is sued and he won't be a happy bunny about it.

FoggyTown

Iom-rf

If they do want to write it off, ask if you can buy the bike back off the insurers, it'll only be marked as a Cat D (maybe a C but unlikely), so if you can buy it back cheaply and repair it that'll be better for you, new/good fairings can be found on the likes of ebay etc.

At 5000 miles its well worth buying back the bike and repairing, also if you do decide to sell it on in the future you've got the pictures as proof it was just superficial damage.