Should I pay back guaranteed commission ?

Dogman213

Hey All, I need some advice - towards the end of last year I went to work for a well known diy store as a designer and as part of your initial training period you receive a guaranteed commission to top up your wages.

My initial training period was nothing short of horrendous due to poor management and miss-communication (i don't want to bore you with the details) but I finally had enough just under 11 weeks and left the job.

Now said employer is asking for over £2k back - stating that I had agreed to return my Guaranteed commission should I leave the company within 12 months when signing my employment contract - here's the thing ! because it started going wrong from the outset I never signed a contract ! should i still pay it back ? due to the really poor treatment I receive I would rather saw off some fingers ?

Any advice would be great ?

nicechap

Pay it back.

paddyandstumpy

Ask them to show you where in the signed contract it says about repaying this.

steampowered

Did you receive the contract and just not sign it?

Or did you never receive the contract?

In legal terms, the different is very important.

sangie595

In terms of legally owing the money back, it's pretty clear. If you didn't sign, it would be very hard to legally get it back. On the other hand, morally, guaranteed commission on something you didn't earn? I'm not interested in morals. That's up to you. But if you think they can't get you back or make your life hell..? For years if they want to...? Oh yes they can...

Dogman213

Received the contract, although never confirmed receipt ! (Or was ever asked to confirm or even sign)

ssparks2003

So you was content to take the job under the terms offered, since you turned up and took the wage offered. But now don't want to be bound by the terms that you was content with?

CIS

Dogman213 wrote: »

Received the contract, although never confirmed receipt ! (Or was ever asked to confirm or even sign)

In contract law where a person has had a chance to see and read a contract then they can be regarded as having given approval if they then begin/continue to work under that agreement without having disputed the points at the time. The contract is accepted by 'conduct' and as you also had the chance to inspect the contract you cannot then later claim you were unaware of specific parts of it.

sangie595

CIS wrote: »

In contract law where a person has had a chance to see and read a contract then they can be regarded as having given approval if they then begin/continue to work under that agreement without having disputed the points at the time. The contract is accepted by 'conduct' and as you also had the chance to inspect the contract you cannot then later claim you were unaware of specific parts of it.

But in employment law, you have missed out an important part. To have a legal right to repayment of payments made, there needs to be a signed clause to that effect. This is an important factor because otherwise employers could simply wander around claiming all their former employees owed them money. Without any evidence to support that at all. There is a difference between a debt and a legally enforceable debt. If the employer took this to court, then they would have no evidence to say that the debt was ever agreed, or the terms agreed. They wouldn't win. But that does not prevent them from other action, such as selling it on to a debt collector, who could chase the OP for years if they are so inclined.

ReadingTim

If you're looking for someone to tell you that you "deserve" the money as some sort of "compensation" for your "horrendous" experience then I suspect you're going to be disappointed.

Notwithstanding the absence of a signed contract, the fact you were there a week shy of a quarter of a year makes it difficult to suggest that, on the balance of probabilities, you didn't accept the terms of the contract, including the requirement to repay the commission if you left within a year.

It is therefore up to assess whether you think your former employer is trying to scare you, or whether you think they'll take action against you. And what would your reaction be if they did, or sold the debt on to someone else who might?

Your call - heads or tails?

sangie595

ReadingTim wrote: »

If you're looking for someone to tell you that you "deserve" the money as some sort of "compensation" for your "horrendous" experience then I suspect you're going to be disappointed.

Notwithstanding the absence of a signed contract, the fact you were there a week shy of a quarter of a year makes it difficult to suggest that, on the balance of probabilities, you didn't accept the terms of the contract, including the requirement to repay the commission if you left within a year.

It is therefore up to assess whether you think your former employer is trying to scare you, or whether you think they'll take action against you. And what would your reaction be if they did, or sold the debt on to someone else who might?

Your call - heads or tails?

I don't disagree on the principle, to be clear. I believe the OP knew the term - they say they did - and so the consequences are theirs to handle.

One thing that had suddenly occurred to me though... The OP describes this as guaranteed commission to top up their wages. Top them up to what? Because if the answer to that is "the national minimum/living wage" then the claim falls entirely. In some places commission forms part of the wage. This is lawful. Provided that the wage is always in accordance with the legal minimums. If the commission is not enough to do this, the employer must still past the legal minimum wage. That part of the wage is often described as the guaranteed commission.