Speeding ticket for company car driver 17 January 2018 at 2:16PM in Motoring 24 replies 13.8K views

TonyMMM

scott284 wrote: »

The bottom line is I don't have to do everybody's job for them.

True - but the likely outcome is that:

a) a s172 requirement will turn up at some point to your current address, but by then it may be too late for a speed awareness course to be offered (if you are eligible) or;

b) paperwork continues to go to your old address and you don't respond which will end up with you being convicted of the s172 offence in your absence and getting 6 points and a large fine. You may be able to get that overturned later, but it will be a hassle (and not a certainty) and you could still be faced with the speeding charge to defend/plead to with no option of an fpn or course..

Aretnap

scott284 wrote: »

The bottom line is I don't have to do everybody's job for them.

No, but you do have to take reasonable steps to make sure that you become aware of any s172 requirement that might be served on you. You might have a record of the date that you originally told the lease company your new address, but they have a record of the fact that they told you they hadn't done it immediately. Given that evidence there's a reasonable argument that there are steps that you could reasonably be expected to take, but haven't taken. You may not like that, but the truth is that doing a bit cleaning up after other people's mistakes from time to time is just a fact of life.

If you do nothing and find yourself in court the magistrates might accept your argument, or they might not. It's up to you whether you want to chance it - it's no skin off our noses either way.

I am not the registered keeper of the vehicle. Therefore there is no evidential presumption that the notice has been served on me, therefore the prosecution have to prove that it was served on me. They have to prove this beyond reasonable doubt.

That's not correct - they only have to prove that it was sent to your last known address. They can then rely on the presumption of service contained in the Interpretation Act, unless the contrary is proven.

Aretnap

Car_54 wrote: »

Even if you are right, the fact is that if the NIP is sent to your old address, and you do not respond, you will eventually be summonsed for the s172 offfence and you will not be in court to make these arguments. You will therefore be found guilty in your absence.

You may well be able to have that cancelled and retried, or even dropped in exchange for a guilty plea to the speeding charge. However, you will have lost any chance of a course or fixed penalty: any fine will be income related, and you will also face costs and a victim surcharge.

Or the first he finds out about it could come when a bailiff tracks down his new address and presents him with a warrant to sieze his goods to cover the unpaid fine. Mr Bailiff is unlikely to be very sympathetic when the OP explains that he didn't know about the conviction and anyway it was all the lease company's fault, and while there might ultimately be ways of resolving the situation, it feels like a lot of hassle for the sake of a speeding ticket IMO.

scott284

Thank you all for your considered responses. The general consensus seems to be that not doing anything carries too high risk.

I will just have to bend over and take the points and fine.

waamo

scott284 wrote: »

Thank you all for your considered responses. The general consensus seems to be that not doing anything carries too high risk.

I will just have to bend over and take the points and fine.

Crikey that’s very negative. You haven’t even had a NIP yet and don’t know if you are going to get one.

Even if you do there is the possibility you will be offered a course rather than points and a fine.

Manxman_in_exile

scott284 wrote: »

The bottom line is I don't have to do everybody's job for them.

I am not the registered keeper of the vehicle. Therefore there is no evidential presumption that the notice has been served on me, therefore the prosecution have to prove that it was served on me. They have to prove this beyond reasonable doubt.

I can put forward the argument that I updated my address with the lease car company on the day when I think the alleged offence occurred, i.e. before the police would have been requiring my address from the lease car company.

Good luck with that approach when (or indeed if) you discover a NIP was served but you didn't physically receive it because you forgot to update your address with the lease company. :rotfl:


BTW are you sure your lease company is the RK?


(PS - this all seems a bit contrived to me. The OP thinks they were flashed by a manned camera a few weeks ago...the OP had forgotten to notify the lease company until they "thought" they were flashed and then did so immediately...no mention of speed limit or what OP thought they were travelling at...yet OP will bend over and take the fine and points...for what exactly? When I got my law degree 40 years ago we had to rely on our own brains and something called a law library. We couldn't ask "randoms" on t'internet!)

AnotherJoe

scott284 wrote: »

Thank you all for your considered responses. The general consensus seems to be that not doing anything carries too high risk.

I will just have to bend over and take the points and fine.

You write as if that’s unjust because you weren’t speeding!

I think you’ve lost track of the fact that if there was a ticket issued that’s ultimately down to your speeding, and your attempt to get out via a loophole is all well and good but doesn’t absolve you of the fact you were speeding and that any delays are pretty much your fault for not advising of change of address much earlier.

One phone call, you’ll know, and also stand a good chance of getting a speeding course and no points which as you realise isn’t better than trying your chances at amateur lawyering in magistrates Court.

.FWIW Even if flashed I understand odds are in your favour you will not get a ticket. Good luck I genuinely hope you don’t, all of us have been there. Some of us have been on speed courses

House_Martin

I have had two speeding tickets driving my company fleet car and the boss found out first and relayed the "good " news to me.
Info will go firstly to the lease holder then onto the boss of the company hiring the lease.
Both times it was within 48 hrs of the offence which were logged by mobile traffic wombles.
Odds are that you wont be fined now with such a delay.
I dont know if its true but I ve read that most are switched off and are there for deterrent purposes.
I would have lost my licence when I steamed through an average speed camera trap (which had nt been up too long ) at well over 60 in a 50 limit on a dual carriageway. Never heard anything despite little flashes emitting from the gantry cameras
I ve seen a camera flash at me and it was snapping something alongside me ( on a dual carriageway ) or something behind.
I think they are set for something like 35 in a 30 , 45 in a 40 before triggering a photo

Car_54

House_Martin wrote: »

Odds are that you wont be fined now with such a delay.

Why do you think that? They have 6 months, and we're only at 6 weeks

AndyMc.....

House_Martin wrote: »

I have had two speeding tickets driving my company fleet car and the boss found out first and relayed the "good " news to me.
Info will go firstly to the lease holder then onto the boss of the company hiring the lease.
Both times it was within 48 hrs of the offence which were logged by mobile traffic wombles.
Odds are that you wont be fined now with such a delay.
I dont know if its true but I ve read that most are switched off and are there for deterrent purposes.
I would have lost my licence when I steamed through an average speed camera trap (which had nt been up too long ) at well over 60 in a 50 limit on a dual carriageway. Never heard anything despite little flashes emitting from the gantry cameras
I ve seen a camera flash at me and it was snapping something alongside me ( on a dual carriageway ) or something behind.
I think they are set for something like 35 in a 30 , 45 in a 40 before triggering a photo

Is about the only useful thing you have said, it’s not about what you think or have heard.