We’d like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum.
This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are – or become – political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!
The Forum now has a brand new text editor, adding a bunch of handy features to use when creating posts. Read more in our how-to guide
Smi
tortus
Posts: 1 Newbie
Hi, 1st Post so hope its in the right place 
I have just watched SO7E03 about Severely Mentally Impaired Council Tax Discount
I am asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine.
His sister who is sadly no longer with us had MS for 30 + years and lived alone with care coming in daily in a property that was shared ownership. 50/50 with a housing association.
While she lived at these premises she always paid full council tax.
Since she passed away her brother has had to pay full council tax for the property because the house has not sold as yet.
I find this crazy, but when he phoned the council and asked for a rebate he was told by one of the very caring council staff that " he could not have a rebate or a reduction because if the property caught fire he would sill expect the fire brigade to attend or the police in the case of a burglary" what an attitude :mad::mad:
Any advice to pass on to him would be great.
Thanks in advance.
Ian
I have just watched SO7E03 about Severely Mentally Impaired Council Tax Discount
I am asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine.
His sister who is sadly no longer with us had MS for 30 + years and lived alone with care coming in daily in a property that was shared ownership. 50/50 with a housing association.
While she lived at these premises she always paid full council tax.
Since she passed away her brother has had to pay full council tax for the property because the house has not sold as yet.
I find this crazy, but when he phoned the council and asked for a rebate he was told by one of the very caring council staff that " he could not have a rebate or a reduction because if the property caught fire he would sill expect the fire brigade to attend or the police in the case of a burglary" what an attitude :mad::mad:
Any advice to pass on to him would be great.
Thanks in advance.
Ian
0
Comments
-
Hi, 1st Post so hope its in the right place
I have just watched SO7E03 about Severely Mentally Impaired Council Tax Discount
I am asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine.
His sister who is sadly no longer with us had MS for 30 + years and lived alone with care coming in daily in a property that was shared ownership. 50/50 with a housing association.
While she lived at these premises she always paid full council tax.
Since she passed away her brother has had to pay full council tax for the property because the house has not sold as yet.
I find this crazy, but when he phoned the council and asked for a rebate he was told by one of the very caring council staff that " he could not have a rebate or a reduction because if the property caught fire he would sill expect the fire brigade to attend or the police in the case of a burglary" what an attitude :mad::mad:
Any advice to pass on to him would be great.
Thanks in advance.
Ian
MS can qualify people for SMi discount, but it also may not. I do not know how this can be applied when the person applying is deceased... I believe the idea behind SMI is that if the person is not able to comprehend in terms of voting for a local councillor so does not know what services they are voting for, then they should not be required to pay for the council tax levied to provide those services. Many people with Parkinsons and MS (the two favourites of the show in question) have no impairment to mental functions and therefore do not qualify for SMI (but may qualify for other elements of disability reduction)
Each council has their own policies on empty properties. My council would give a discount until the property is sold if it was staying in an executors account. If the property belonged to the brother now, then there would be no discount. However, this is only one council. Each council makes their own rules, some would apply a premium to the account, some would keep it the same, some would offer discount. None of which are 'incorrect'
What I would say is that if the property still belongs to her estate, and her estate has no money, then nothing can be paid. If there will be money once the house is sold then obviously the council tax can be paid from that.
You can be 'upset' about the attitude, but it is correct. Many people call and say 'well the property is empty, we are not using any services! when thats a) not what council tax is paid for anyway, its not a service charge and b) they are using services indirectly. You want the road maintained so that people can access the property, you would want it attended if a fire or burglary, its not just a 'I pay £100 to get the bins emptied!!!'
What exactly did he ask for a rebate for? You don't just 'get one'0 -
Not sure if i read this right and forgive me if i'm wrong. You're asking how to claim for SMI for a person that's deceased? :eek:Hi, 1st Post so hope its in the right place
I have just watched SO7E03 about Severely Mentally Impaired Council Tax Discount
I am asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine.
His sister who is sadly no longer with us had MS for 30 + years and lived alone with care coming in daily in a property that was shared ownership. 50/50 with a housing association.
While she lived at these premises she always paid full council tax.
Since she passed away her brother has had to pay full council tax for the property because the house has not sold as yet.
I find this crazy, but when he phoned the council and asked for a rebate he was told by one of the very caring council staff that " he could not have a rebate or a reduction because if the property caught fire he would sill expect the fire brigade to attend or the police in the case of a burglary" what an attitude :mad::mad:
Any advice to pass on to him would be great.
Thanks in advance.
Ian0 -
Its not clear whether you mean a reduction prior to death or post death ?
As you've mentioned SMI I'd assume you're meaning prior to death and whether a reduction could be backdated ?I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a specialist Council Tax paralegal assisting landlords and Council Tax payers with council tax disputes and valuation tribunals. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.0 -
Hi, 1st Post so hope its in the right place
I have just watched SO7E03 about Severely Mentally Impaired Council Tax Discount
I am asking this on behalf of a good friend of mine.
His sister who is sadly no longer with us had MS for 30 + years and lived alone with care coming in daily in a property that was shared ownership. 50/50 with a housing association.
While she lived at these premises she always paid full council tax.
Since she passed away her brother has had to pay full council tax for the property because the house has not sold as yet.
I find this crazy, but when he phoned the council and asked for a rebate he was told by one of the very caring council staff that " he could not have a rebate or a reduction because if the property caught fire he would sill expect the fire brigade to attend or the police in the case of a burglary" what an attitude :mad::mad:
Any advice to pass on to him would be great.
Thanks in advance.
Ian
I suspect your friend won't get very far asking for a SMI disregard for a deceased individual as the forms require signig by the GP and having the appropriate benefit entitlement.
Who is the owner?
If the sisters estate is still the owner then property exemptions should apply - it may be that the estate is still the owner and the exemptions have ceased, so when the property is sold the brother can get his money back
link“You’re only here for a short visit.
Don’t hurry, don't worry and be sure to smell the flowers along the way.”Walter Hagen
365 Day 1p Challenge for 2021 #41 ✅
Jar £440.31/£667.95 and Bank £389.67/£667.950 -
In respect of the SMI form them someone acting in respect of the deceased estate should be able to get the SMI form signed to say they meet the impairment criteria. The benefit side of the qualifying criteria is a separate matter and it can be satisfied by showing entitlement, actual receipt is not a legislative requirement.I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a specialist Council Tax paralegal assisting landlords and Council Tax payers with council tax disputes and valuation tribunals. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.0
-
poppy12345 wrote: »Not sure if i read this right and forgive me if i'm wrong. You're asking how to claim for SMI for a person that's deceased? :eek:
Yes, that's quite normal.
It was featured on the Martin Lewis Money Show last month (most Councils sadly aren't listing smi on their websites and clearly most with smi cannot ask for the rebate themselves so many executors and/or relatives are now requesting the rebate by emailing their local authority and receiving the £ within weeks).Please be polite to OPs and remember this is a site for Claimants and Appellants to seek redress against their bank, ex-boss or retailer. If they wanted morality or the view of the IoD or Bank they'd ask them.0 -
I suspect your friend won't get very far asking for a SMI disregard for a deceased individual as the forms require signig by the GP and having the appropriate benefit entitlement.
Untrue. See above & CIS.
Indeed most who are currently asking for the smi rebate are relatives of deceased former Council Tax payers.Please be polite to OPs and remember this is a site for Claimants and Appellants to seek redress against their bank, ex-boss or retailer. If they wanted morality or the view of the IoD or Bank they'd ask them.0 -
My manager wouldn't backdate that far retrospectively even if you shoved the legislation in her face.“You’re only here for a short visit.
Don’t hurry, don't worry and be sure to smell the flowers along the way.”Walter Hagen
365 Day 1p Challenge for 2021 #41 ✅
Jar £440.31/£667.95 and Bank £389.67/£667.950 -
My manager wouldn't backdate that far retrospectively even if you shoved the legislation in her face.
Neither would my old manager (but then again she also pretty much made it up as she went for most things) however a Valuation Tribunal may well say otherwise if the case is pushed through to that point. Unfortunately as the legislation stays silent on backdating it has become the issue it is today, as the President stated "The requirement to make a refund of council tax going back some 20 years may seem odd, but it is not the only odd feature of council tax law".
Backdating is the point which has come up a lot over previous years and the Valuation Tribunal President (as was at the time) considered the issues deeply a few years ago. As of about 6 month ago or so the same backdating arguments were winning tribunals (not for SMI but the same principals applied) as I used the same argument for another tribunal case. What is needed is a High Court case to give an overall guidance on the issue.I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery but instead work as a specialist Council Tax paralegal assisting landlords and Council Tax payers with council tax disputes and valuation tribunals. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.0 -
I know it isn't the place to raise it but it requires saying.
Martin Lewis and his towers are always banging on and on about claiming this & that and now it’s SMIs, my council has a huge back log of SMI applications to process and the local GPs are now on about charging for the forms to be completed because of the number of forms coming through their doors – I know they can’t and they have been told this but they are under pressure as it is
When the accounts of all the non-payers of council tax are taken out of the equation then where is this lost revenue supposed to be collected from - the other council tax payers obviously.
The police, fire brigade etc still want their money no matter how many pay it.
Council tax bands are increasing next year as it is
Sooner or later all exemptions and disregards will have to be overhauled like benefits was to Universal credit.
Rant over.“You’re only here for a short visit.
Don’t hurry, don't worry and be sure to smell the flowers along the way.”Walter Hagen
365 Day 1p Challenge for 2021 #41 ✅
Jar £440.31/£667.95 and Bank £389.67/£667.950
This discussion has been closed.
Confirm your email address to Create Threads and Reply
Categories
- All Categories
- 354.3K Banking & Borrowing
- 254.4K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 455.4K Spending & Discounts
- 247.3K Work, Benefits & Business
- 604K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 178.4K Life & Family
- 261.5K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 16K Discuss & Feedback
- 37.7K Read-Only Boards