Parking dispute help. County Court Claim issued, my DEFENCE in post #63

Quentin

Your question was not answered

Got missed. Not on purpose. You can see how busy this forum is and how quickly threads move from the front page.

Although it's too late to help you, others coming to this thread will see the answer and know those forms are not compulsory and need not be returned

neopl

Quentin wrote: »

Your question was not answered

Got missed. Not on purpose. You can see how busy this forum is and how quickly threads move from the front page.

Although it's too late to help you, others coming to this thread will see the answer and know those forms are not compulsory and need not be returned

Of course, my apologies if i came across as being sarcastic with my comment. That was not my intent, I am greatful for all the help I recieved on these forums, and was simply expressing my releif that my decided course of action was indeed correct.

neopl

Hello,



Last week, I recieved a reply from Vehicle Control Services in response to my very comprehensive Letter Before Claim response that I sent to them. To their Letter Before Claim I followed a template that is posted on these forums. In my Letter Before Claim I requested all of these points, being so sure they will just let it be and not answer, but alas, they did answer, looks like this is going down right to the wire...

Can someone advise at to what I should do at this stage? Thank you!

[FONT=&quot]1. an explanation of the cause of action
2. whether you are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether you are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are; where it is claimed the vehicle was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
7. Provide me a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by the IPC code of practice section B, clause 1.1 !!!8220;establishing yourself as the creditor!!!8221;
8. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
9. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
10. Provide details of the original charge, and detail any interest and administrative or other charges added
11. Provide a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Here is the letter I recieved from them after requesting all the above information. (Please note that in addition to the written response, they also included A4 printout of the sign that is displayed on the street, and google maps satelite image pin pointing where the signs are located.)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

We write regarding the above matter.


Whether we are pursuing you as driver or keeper/ whether we are relying on the provisions on Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012

We can confirm that we can utilise the provisions of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012 and pursuing you as the registered keeper which enititles Operators to pursue the Registered Keeper where the Driver's details have not been disclosed. We are satisfied that our Notice meets the requirements of Schedule 4 of POPA.

What are the details of the claim [FONT=&quot]I [/FONT]An explanation of the cause of action.

The vehicle bearing the registration number Y52RBY was observed parked in the John Snow Place Residential Car Park on 14th October 2017 at 14:59 without displaying a valid permit. This gave rise to a claim for £100.00 as per the terms and conditions of the private land.

This claim is for a breach of contract and not a claim for trespass.

Photographic evidence of the Driver.

There is no requirement or obligation for us to take photographic evidence of the driver and we are therefore not obligated to provide the same. Our evidence is based on photographs of the vehicle which confirm that the vehicle was observed in contravention of the terms and conditions of the private land.

Break down of costs:

This is provided on the Letter Before Claim. For the avoidance of doubt our claim is for:
Parking Charge:
Debt Recovery Charge:
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT] £100.00
£60.00

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
Any further costs which may be incurred to pursue the Parking Charge and interest under s69 County Court Act 1984.

Copy of the contract between the landowner of the parking site

This is a commercially sensitive document which we are unable to disclose to you. However, should the need arise; we will disclose the same to the Court.

Section B clause 1: 1 of the IPC code of practice requires the contract to be disclosed to the IPC. We are satisfied this has been done and that the IPC are satisfied of our right to enforce parking at the site. We are able to confirm that we have Approved Operator Status due to our full compliance with the IPC code of practice.

A copy of the alleged contract with the driver

The contract does not have to be in writing and can be created, as in this case, by conduct. The contract was created on 17 April 2017 when the vehicle entered the private land and stopped where it should not have done so.

Site overhead plan and signage

Please find enclosed the site overhead plan and copies of the signage for the site. We confirm that our signs meet the requirements of the IPC codes of practice.

InformationSheet and Reply Form

These were already provided to you with the Letter Before Claim that you acknowledged receivmg.

We trust this clarifies matters. If you would like to resolve the matter, then please call the number below.

Quentin

The newbies faq #2 covers court claims from LBCCA right through to the hearing


If/when you get a claim, then how to deal with this is your next step


In the meantime you could study that post in the FAQ and start researching for your defence

Coupon-mad

In my Letter Before Claim I requested all of these points, being so sure they will just let it be and not answer,

What made you think that? They never drop out and a court claim was inevitable, IMHO.

No idea why you left the question in your letter, asking for the info & reply sheet, if they'd already sent that with the LBC. Never just copy a template verbatim, you are meant to adapt it to suit and edit stuff out.

The purpose of the reply to the LBC was not to stop them, but to trip them up and give you ammo for the defence to the inevitable claim. You can win this but only by defending via the court process, not by some letter that makes them run away! There is no such magic wand (yet).

The contract was created on 17 April 2017 when the vehicle entered the private land and stopped where it should not have done so.

Oh no it wasn't, you are a resident and very likely 'granted' the right to park at your home already, under your lease/tenancy.

We are satisfied that our Notice meets the requirements of Schedule 4 of POPA.

But we are satisfied it does not. Was the first PCN a postal one, or did you have an actial PCN on the car, or was it a 'THIS IS NOT A PARKING CHARGE' (myparkingcharge.com) on the car?

Have you checked the terms of your lease, and the points about your 'rights of way, rights to pass/repass, and/or Rights of Third Parties Act 1999? This is what you will need to know, and show, to win at a hearing (you can do it!).

neopl

hat made you think that? They never drop out and a court claim was inevitable, IMHO.

Thanks for the quick replies. I was hoping this would not go to court, as after reading these forums I got an impression that only a tiny fraction of these cases does go to court, I suppose it has to fall on somone.

I also think it is really unbelivable that they would purse me this far for parking in my own spot outside my own house.... for simply forgetting to put the permit on the dash one day... as to my defense...''umm, judge, I live there'

As to the template, I did adapt it to my case, as per all the help I recieved here, the reply sheet bit must of unfortunetely slipped.


So in summary, I just wait for the court summons now?

Coupon-mad

I got an impression that only a tiny fraction of these cases does go to court,

Not once they issue a LBC. You are (almost) already there, but you can win.

I also think it is really unbelivable that they would purse me this far for parking in my own spot outside my own house.... for simply forgetting to put the permit on the dash one day... as to my defense...''umm, judge, I live there'

We agree and you will find we have THOUSANDS of 'own space' threads with defences already written, and cases won almost every time.

So in summary, I just wait for the court summons now?

There is no summons, it's not a criminal case.

And we'd rather you were proactive and started searching for and reading all the thousands of other residential cases on here, there is some cracking advice.

Also, you can complain to the Managing Agents (again, some great letters have already been written to do that, and sometimes to get the MA to cancel the PCN just in time!).

No links, search the forum for 'residential lease rights' or 'own space defence'. Start your reading now and by the weekend you will no doubt be fired up to write to the MA in the strongest terms.

neopl

Thanks for your help. Time is extremely short in my life unfortunetely but I will do my best to get my self up to speed.

Also, you can complain to the Managing Agents (again, some great letters have already been written to do that, and sometimes to get the MA to cancel the PCN just in time!).

The little parking outside my house is owned by the city council, I did speak to them about this before but they refused to do anything. Basically saying that this is between me and the VCS. I feel it is a case of low paid office workers not being bothered to actually do something outside their routine. I will look up some of the letters that have been written and see if I can press them again.

Quentin

neopl wrote: »

As to the template, I did adapt it to my case, as per all the help I recieved here, the reply sheet bit must of unfortunetely slipped.....

The reply sheet (you complained about not getting with your LBCCA) is irrelevant - we advise not to complete it anyway!


Though of course now double check everything you write down in your draft defence and make sure similar errors don't creep in which will come back and bite you when this gets to court!


(When you say you have unfortunately extremely short time ln your "life" - is that literally or because you are a busy bod??)

Snakes_Belly

I think that a tiny fraction go to court because a lot of people pay up at various stages in the process.

MO of VCS and Excel is about bullying and frightening people with the threat of going to court so they have to be seen to follow through otherwise it would be an empty threat. Some PPC's don't follow through although VCS and their sister company Excel do pursue claims through the courts.

I am at the stage where I have just submitted my defence regarding a claim from Excel the sister company to VCS. The director of these companies is really milking the public and if everyone rolled over and paid up it will never stop.

You do need to read up on the cases etc. and if you look at the Parking Pranksters website there is a list of cases with the transcripts. I would also read some of the posts relating to VCS and Excel as they don't play fair and you need to have evidence of everything that you sent to them.

On the plus side when the case gets to court they may send a solicitor or representative who is not that clued up. That's my take on it but I am just a poster on here for help and not an expert.