Cancelling BT Broadband forces a new 12 month line rental?

andyca

This is true for new provisions macman, but I firmly believe engineers are tasked with disconnecting lines in the cabinet when they don't need the slots and can disable services centrally, purely so BT can charge the £130 for a re-connection every time a house has a change of tenants or owner.

Now where did I put my tinfoil hat...

boatman

http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/products/broadband-cease-charge/
So if you stop all services, there is no charge..

andyca

That's because when you do they lock you in to a new 12 month line rental contract boatman.

iniltous

boatman wrote: »

http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/products/broadband-cease-charge/
So if you stop all services, there is no charge..

andyca wrote: »

This is true for new provisions macman, but I firmly believe engineers are tasked with disconnecting lines in the cabinet when they don't need the slots and can disable services centrally, purely so BT can charge the £130 for a re-connection every time a house has a change of tenants or owner.

Now where did I put my tinfoil hat...

You may 'firmly believe' stopped lines are disconnected in the PCP effectively turning them into ceased lines, but you are wrong in your belief...

andyca

iniltous wrote: »

You may 'firmly believe' stopped lines are disconnected in the PCP effectively turning them into ceased lines, but you are wrong in your belief...

If i'm wrong in my belief what is the justification for the £130 charge for something which does not require an engineer to come out to the address?

iniltous

You are confusing the retail price a provider can ask for, and the actual wholesale price Openreach charge for a 'new' line..... if a provider (CP) wanted to charge £500 for a 'new' line' even if the property already had a working line,and zero line rental for 5 years, that would be entirely up to them as their 'retail' offer, Openreach would still get the wholesale rental price for a WLR or LLU local loop, and a install or takeover fee, depending on how the provider 'processed' their order.

You will find that different company's charge different amounts for a 'new' line' but even those that charge in the order of £130 ( which is much more than the actual OR wholesale price for a 'new' line) will offer 'free' installs if you take line and broadband together....CP's can charge whatever they like, the 'market' decides if it's good value....see the OR price list if you want to see the relatively small amount OR get for new lines or takeovers, compared to what 'retail' company's ask for.

If there already is an Openreach 'line' in a property, and someone wants to either take it over from a working state, or from a stopped state or a ceased state , it's really dependent on the particular retail provider(CP) if they say a 'new' line is required , or they can takeover the existing connection...obviously if a 'line' has not been in service for a long time, it's much more likely that CP's will say a 'new' line is required...if the line was very recently in service then a 'takeover' should be offered, but if your chosen provider insists a 'new' line is required, when you know only a takeover is required, and that makes a difference in the price the provider wants, then pick a different provider....


If a property isn't paying for a connection via a CP, then OR are perfectly at liberty to move (at least in part) that connection to another location, to provide or restore service for someone else...if that happens then the property , should it order service again in the future , will need a 'new' connection, even though there is a socket in the property, but this movement of cable pairs only happens if there is a shortage of cable pairs in that particular area, otherwise lines are left in place,( often for many years) if lines are ceased as part of a bulk cleanse then those lines are ceased at the exchange not at a PCP ( cabinet )

andyca

iniltous wrote: »

You are confusing the retail price a provider can ask for, and the actual wholesale price Openreach charge for a 'new' line..... if a provider (CP) wanted to charge £500 for a 'new' line' even if the property already had a working line,and zero line rental for 5 years, that would be entirely up to them as their 'retail' offer, Openreach would still get the wholesale rental price for a WLR or LLU local loop, and a install or takeover fee, depending on how the provider 'processed' their order.

You will find that different company's charge different amounts for a 'new' line' but even those that charge in the order of £130 ( which is much more than the actual OR wholesale price for a 'new' line) will offer 'free' installs if you take line and broadband together....CP's can charge whatever they like, the 'market' decides if it's good value....see the OR price list if you want to see the relatively small amount OR get for new lines or takeovers, compared to what 'retail' company's ask for.

Well I've made no claims that line rental charges are unfair, however now you bring it up, everything I have read on the subject seems to suggest BT are being forced to reduce their line rental next year as they do not offer value for money as wholesale line rental prices have gone down and these reductions have not been passed on to consumers. So that and £130 for reconnecting a line that was probably only disconnected so they could charge to reconnect in not great.

iniltous wrote: »

If there already is an Openreach 'line' in a property, and someone wants to either take it over from a working state, or from a stopped state or a ceased state , it's really dependent on the particular retail provider(CP) if they say a 'new' line is required , or they can takeover the existing connection...obviously if a 'line' has not been in service for a long time, it's much more likely that CP's will say a 'new' line is required...if the line was very recently in service then a 'takeover' should be offered, but if your chosen provider insists a 'new' line is required, when you know only a takeover is required, and that makes a difference in the price the provider wants, then pick a different provider....


If a property isn't paying for a connection via a CP, then OR are perfectly at liberty to move (at least in part) that connection to another location, to provide or restore service for someone else...if that happens then the property will need a 'new' connection, even though there is a socket in the property, but this only happens if there is a shortage of cable pairs in that area, otherwise lines are left in place, if lines are ceased as part of a bulk cleanse then those lines are ceased at the exchange not at a PCP ( cabinet )

However it is technically performed, in my experience BT are extremely quick to disconnect/curtail/cleanse/cease (or whatever verb you would like to substitute here) to ensure they can charge the full £130 when taking over a line form a past tenant or owner.
I'm fairly certain it was less than 48 hours between having a dial tone to having a conversation with BT who said I had to pay £130 to reconnect the line.
As BT/Openreach have a virtual monopoly of the UK telephone system I suspect it quite a nice little earner ensuring every time someone in the UK moves home they get £130 or a new BT Broadband customer.

iniltous

andyca wrote: »

Well I've made no claims that line rental charges are unfair, however now you bring it up, everything I have read on the subject seems to suggest BT are being forced to reduce their line rental next year as they do not offer value for money as wholesale line rental prices have gone down and these reductions have not been passed on to consumers. So that and £130 for reconnecting a line that was probably only disconnected so they could charge to reconnect in not great.



However it is technically performed, in my experience BT are extremely quick to disconnect/curtail/cleanse/cease (or whatever verb you would like to substitute here) to ensure they can charge the full £130 when taking over a line form a past tenant or owner.
I'm fairly certain it was less than 48 hours between having a dial tone to having a conversation with BT who said I had to pay £130 to reconnect the line.
As BT/Openreach have a virtual monopoly of the UK telephone system I suspect it quite a nice little earner ensuring every time someone in the UK moves home they get £130 or a new BT Broadband customer.

Sorry to labour the point, but 'BT' are a retail provider and Openreach are the 'wholesaler' , absolutely no one is forced to use 'BT' as their provider, don't like 'BT' or 'BT' prices, simple, don't use BT, ...and by the way 'BT' aren't forced to reduce prices by Ofcom, anymore than Sky or TalkTalk are 'forced' to reduce prices , (apart from recently in one very specific area)
.....Openreach prices are regulated and are there for all to see on the the OR website (price list)...you may say BT/Openreach 'same thing' but it really isn't.

BT don't 'cease' Openreach stuff, BT have no more influence on that as a Sky or TT or anyone else, and OR don't get anything like £130 for a new line, it's about £45...so where is the incentive to 'cease lines quickly' as you claim ?, if they 'deliberately' cease lines quickly , do you think £45 covers the cost of reinstating that line after ceasing it, it's cost effective to OR to have lines 'taken over' as it doesn't need engineering visits to the property in question.

Like I said, if a property had a very recent working line, and 'BT' want £130 for a 'new' line, then don't use BT, try Sky or Talk Talk or whoever and see if they say it's a new line or takeover , and what they 'charge' ...and what's more ,if a new line is required (regardless of how long has expired since the line was last in use) then different providers will charge different prices.
You quote BT and £130, but BT charge nothing for 'new' line if you take line rental and broadband together, so even if you don't like it, it's a perfectly reasonable 'retail' position to make line and broadband 'look' better value than line rental on its own, so the customer opts for both services from them....

As I said obviously you can 'believe' anything you like, but it doesn't necessarily make it true, and what's more the reality (truth) is easy to obtain, some people though don't want to 'believe' in the truth, they are happy with the default position 'if it's BT it must be bad' regardless of it being justified or accurate,

In a new build home, the builder is paid by Openreach for ( in part ) providing the phone-line infrastructure into the home ( 20 years ago that figure was £250 per property) , so even if £130 is charged for that undeniable 'new' line, it's still less than what it cost OR to get the 'line' onto the property