Faulty meter last 5 years or so / Reclaim overpayment.

davethetaller

A friend of mine needs some advice, from those knowledgeable on here, about a faulty electric meter, and the monthly overpayment that this has caused. Matters came to a head, a couple of weeks ago, when her supplier, (Sainsburys), sent her a letter, that her D/D was to rise again. She contacted me, to say that she knew all gas and electric prices were galloping on, but not at this rate.

We compared notes, after I explained that electricity can't leak away like an unexplained water bill, and it was being used somewhere. I concluded that, her usage should be much the same as mine, i.e. no tumble dryer, minimal oven use, uses gas to heat the hot water, lots of LEDs, no electric shower etc., and we should do a meter read each day.

She went to read the meter, and shock horror, there was no display.
The last time that Sainsburys read it, was March this year, and I guess, the last price increase then, was due to this "high" reading.

So, the day after, she phoned to report that there was no reading on it,
and a couple of days later, they came and fitted a (non Smart) one to replace the faulty (non Smart) one. Photos were taken by the engineer, and my friend, of the old, and replacement (reconditioned) meter.

My usage is slightly less than the national average, at 8kw.per day.
Her usage, over the last 10 days or so, has been consistent, at 9 units per day. This has been her usual cycle of daily living, without being unduly economical. That should give a monthly bill of 30 days x 9 units@14p kw., plus standing charge and 5%VAT. Thats £45 ish./month
Their projected ongoing figure was £95 monthly, based on their estimated reading, of the now replaced, faulty meter.

So, their estimation, and her direct debits, have equated over the last couple of years, to double the number of kilowatts, that she has physically used, based on what she has paid (as an average user.)

So where does she stand regarding the overpayment? When she phones in her usage at the end of the first month on the new meter, demonstrating that her usage is that of a normal domestic customer, are they likely to do a pro rata adjustment, for the 2 years that she has been a customer?
Secondly, prior to Sainsburys, she was with British Gas for 3 years,(same outfit). Is there a case for a refund there, based on the same
logic, or is she out of time?

Thanks in anticipation.

ROY47

We compared notes, after I explained that electricity can't leak away like an unexplained water bill

unfortunately that can happen if you have a high resistance fault to earth / neutral in the property the meter registers the usage unknown to the owner and doesn't blow a fuse on the faulty circuit

Not saying that is the case this time

House_Martin

Blank screens are very common, especially when the meter itself is a load of rubbish costing £5 each .Thats progress for you
you probably have the Ampy digital meter, or possibly the same meter with Siemens as the maker..
suppliers are nt much use on picking up on these faults.I have many of these on my rounds which have been blank for many years.
These electric meters do not have batteries, they are mains powered.They fail because they are inferior cheap and nasty rubbish. My record for one remaining blank is getting on for 8 years.The suppliers are just so pathetic about replacing them, especially EDF. Customers like them because although they continue paying the same direct debit they can then use as much electricity as they like with electric heaters in every room to save on their gas bills. They even go so far as not to answer the door if a meter fitter comes to exchange the meter.
If only the true reading could be reinstated from the blank display it would shock the fiddling customers who would have to pay for every kwh.
Just another good reason for smart meters to take over and end this free energy bonanza.

SammenForLivet2

From the first outset, it seems like the battery in the meters LED display has gone.This doesn't mean the electricity meter was recording incorrectly all along, just that the battery display has run out. From what I know, they'll look at the last actual reading, and then work out what the meter reading should have been at the time of the meters removal, based on two meter readings from the new meter- and average usage over this period. This isn't likely to lead to a significant refund; and in any case, this would only be for a few months overpayment as they would have billed her correctly to the actual reading in March.

In anycase, it will be extremely difficult to dispute a now removed meters accuracy; and I doubt that SE will back-bill more than twelve months; as there is an obligation in their conditions to read the meter by the customer at least twice a year; and any un-normal usage should have been picked up then.

System

SammenForLivet2 wrote: »

; as there is an obligation in their conditions to read the meter by the customer at least twice a year; and any un-normal usage should have been picked up then.

The obligation to read a non-smart meter was changed to once a year in April 2016.

matelodave

AFAIK the obligation was to try and obtain a reading once per year, however that does not oblige the company to come and read it every year, they can ask you to do it for them. However the OP suggest that the meter was last read by Sainsbury's in March of this year, so isn't due until next March.

A lot of these problems can be sorted out by customers checking their bills against the meter and getting any estimated bills correcets immediately so there isn't an accumulation of estimated bills.

Most bills that I've had have a invitaion to send in my own reading which I did once a month anyway until I got my smart meter and I'll do again if and when I change supplier and it becomes a dumb one.

Just spending 5 minutes a month you'll know whether the meter is working, how much you are consuming and whether your bills are correct. It's easy and almost effortless, certainly less effort than trying to unravel a problem that might have happened a year or so ago.

here is the info from the licence conditions

Condition 21B. Billing based on meter readings
21B.1 If a Customer provides a meter reading to the licensee that the licensee considers
reasonably accurate, or if the Electricity Meter is read by the licensee, the licensee
must take all reasonable steps to reflect the meter reading in the next Bill or
statement of account sent to the Customer.
21B.2 If the licensee considers that a meter reading provided by a Customer is not
reasonably accurate, the licensee must take all reasonable steps to contact the
Customer to obtain a new meter reading from him.
21B.3 Paragraphs 21B.4 and 21B.5 apply from 31 December 2014.
21B.4 The licensee must take all reasonable steps to obtain a meter reading (including
any meter reading transmitted electronically from a meter to the licensee or
provided by the Customer and accepted by the licensee) for each of its Customers
at least once every year.
This paragraph does not apply in relation to any Customer with a Prepayment
Meter.
21B.5 The licensee must make available a Bill or statement of account to each of its
Customers at least twice yearly and at least quarterly to any Customer who
requests it or who has Online Account Management.
This paragraph does not apply in relation to any Customer with:
(a) a Prepayment Meter;
(b) a Smart Metering System;
(c) unmetered supply as defined in regulation 2 of the Electricity (Unmetered
Supply) Regulations 2001(1).
21B.6 Where a Customer requests Online Account Management the licensee must
comply with that request.
21B.7 Where a Customer requests an explanation of how their Bill or statement of
account was derived the licensee must comply with that request in plain and
intelligible language.
21B.8 The licensee must not make a specific charge for the provision of a Bill or
statement of account or for access in an appropriate way to the consumption data
used to calculate that Bill or statement of account.

System

@matelodave . Point taken. That explains why I have had three meter reading visits this year when I give my two suppliers gas and meter readings every week!

davethetaller

Many thanks to all posters; here's me thinking that due to the length of my post, you would have passed it over without reading it!

Some really good info there, I think that the big lesson to learn primarily,
is to read the meter on a regular basis, to avoid these issues.
My friend has learned a useful lesson.

Thanks.

firefox1956

@davethetaller.
Your post was a joy to read.
Capital letters, punctuation & paragraphs.
Glad you & your friend got sorted.

davethetaller

firefox1956 wrote: »

@davethetaller.
Your post was a joy to read.
Capital letters, punctuation & paragraphs.
Glad you & your friend got sorted.

It were a hart liftin moment to reed that praise.

The poit lorryet needunt worry jus yet

Innit.

Dave.