Esa hell ..desperate for feedback and advice anyone please :-)

pipkin71

fumin37 wrote: »

I have already stated they were aware yes.There are no illegal issues .recording has been deleted and any content shared is no different from me explaining what someone has said .which i am at liberty to do.

It's not illegal to record a conversation between two people, where one party is not aware of the fact they are being recorded. Problems can arise when that information is shared and, effectively, the CAB worker has shared their recorded conversation with you, since they knew the other person was being recorded.

I think the CAB worker has been placed in an unfortunate position and there's something that doesn't sit right with this.

epitome

Ok...

I'm wondering how you managed to get an incoming call from the DWP at the same time you were in the CAB office?

I think people here are concerned about "CAB guidelines" with phone recordings.

I'm not bothered at all about the recording, it was for personal use and will be deleted by the OP.

Back on topic...OP,
You are right, it is a difficult job for her to do, and she obviously is a bit stressed in her job, but I got enough info from that. It is a good job you recorded it, so you could type it out here.

She said:
ESA 18/06/2016 - 11/06/2017 Closed because you failed the medical (No LCW) You MR'd and then Appealed.
"You missed 2 appeals, but then...oh yeah it was put back on" (my words)
You also made a New Claim on a worsened condition
ESA from12/06/17 onwards, You failed the medical and you appealed and won the appeal, you will be awarded WRAG from 11/09/17. ( 3 or 4 weeks back pay)

Now combine what she said with what you said in your first post..
You said:
"I claimed from Nov '16, failed, missed 2 appeals then allowed to have a 3rd appeal(hearing) in May '17, lost the appeal, immediately made a new claim, failed assessment, appealed and won appeal.


Conclusion:
There is a difference on your original start date from June 2016 to November 2016.... This is irrelevant as it changes nothing.

There is a difference for your end date of the first claim you said lost the appeal in May 2017, she said to the 11/06/2017....
When an appeal is lost the ESA claim should be closed from the day after the appeal hearing, so your claim should have been closed from xx May 2017. But they will continue to pay you until they close your claim so I believe your payments continued to 11/06/17 which is strange as that is a Sunday.

1. Either she was reading the screen wrong and your claim did close in xx May 2017 creating an overpayment to 11/06/17 or
2. The DWP made an error and actually did close your ESA on the 11/06/17

Then you made claim 2 to ESA from 12/06/17...they paid you until you failed 18/09/2017. You then claimed JSA (because you would not be entitled to ESA payment on appeal). You appealed and won the appeal.

I assume that JSA is now closed, it must be as she said you will be paid tomorow.

The 11/09/17 is the 14th week from the 12/06/17 so that confirms, your claim start date as 12/06/17.


If there is a gap in your claims between xx May 2017 - 12/06/17 which is marked as overpayment, there is nothing you can do about it now. You could have claimed the new claim backdated to the day after tribunal, but as you didn't.... it is too late now.

If there is no gap between your claims
1st ends 11/06/17
2nd starts 12/06/17
Then there is nothing to worry about as there is no gap in claims or payments.

However, I believe, as your 2nd claim was from 12/06/17 it is not going to qualify for "paid WRAG component".... so you will not be getting any £29.05 per week arrears or otherwise. She was wrong in that respect.

I think that solves virtually everything. You can if you like, ask what date the first claim is showing as ending.... is it May or 11/06/17? There is nothing you can do about it now..

You can wait for the letter, or when you have recieved money...tomorrow...or when ever you receive it... you could phone ESA and ask what your award rate is... is it £73.10 or £102.15 ? If you are being paid tomorrow, she should have been able to see your award, but maybe she didn't understand what she was looking at.

fumin37

Hi Epitome .
wow thankyou !as for the recording ive given up trying to explain.All i know is its fine .The matter was discussed with my worker plus i apologised if they felt they had been put in a difficult position and they were completely ok with it as it was on my OWN phone and they know it is purely fir my own clarification.I had recieved a call back from the dwp and yes i was with my worker at the time .I have always been totally upfront with my worker about the fact that i record all my calls with the dwp.So as far as i am concerned that issue is irrelevent.My worker did nothing wrong and neither did i.
yes i think you a right the claim would have been closed on 11/06/17 .It definitely wasnt May as the final tribunal i managed to get to was in june.
i remember that the claim was not closed for some time atleast a couple of weeks as i had to wait for it to close to sign on jsa .in that time period i was diagnosed with a new problem and signed off with that and a worsening of my original condition.sick note was faxed over amd i was put back on ESA immediatley.I didnt even make a new claim BEFORE i was put back on it.I went into the JC to sign on and was told the JSA claim wasnt even live because i had been automaticaly put back onto ESA based on my fit note.
i remember at the time my representative was quite surprised by this.
As for the rest of it all.My brilliant CAB worker drafted a letter for me this morning asking for all dates of all medicals,tribunals,MRs closed claims and opened claims etc.
to be delt with within a reasonable period of time.
im sick of it all and think its incredably wrong that after a year and a half of fighting i will now lose that 29 a week.I feel the tribunal service new i would be forced to make another new claim.And they had ample evidence of my long and complex med history and conditions .
I guess i feel the tribunal and wca were totally wrong in their asessmemts to begin with.
If i hadnt been in such a devestaing place in my personal life i would have been able to think more clearly and fight my corner with more strength.I couldnt even ask for help at that point i was just scraping through the days.
I dont know where i will go from here ,but i do know it is impossible to live on that income.
thankyou very very much for your kindness and the time youve taken in looking into all of this for me Epitome.

fumin37

Looking through my bank statement i can see that i was recieving ESA still throughout May and the last fortnightly Esa payment was 7th june.
i then recieved a forward paymemt from JSA for 41 .78 on the 14th june
and on 21 June i was back on Fortnightly ESA again.

NeilCr

Actually I wish you would try and explain and answer the questions I asked

I completely appreciate that you are having a very difficult time and I think that epitome is giving you great advice and support

My concern is that this thread would appear to be suggesting that a CAB worker was fine with having a conversation on the phone (doesn’t matter whose it is) with a DWP official without that DWP official knowing that they were being recorded.

For clarity - and for others reading this thread - that is not something my CAB office would countenance.

fumin37

Looking through my bank statement i can see that i was recieving ESA still throughout May and sick note stating worsening condition was faxed on the 6th june to ESA (the day of the third tribunal i managed to attend)the last fortnightly Esa payment was 7th june.
i then was told to sign on JSA by a man at ESA who also stated the tribunal were wrong not to tske my new evidence into account and as long as i could prove i was worse and the new condition then i would be put straight back on ESA .So i gave JSA and ESA another copy of my sick note ,and signed the paperwork and then recieved a "forward" payment from JSA for 41 .78 on the 14th june
.around the 19th/20th june i went to my alloted apointment at the job centre to sign on wjere i was told much to my confusion as no one had informed me,that i didnt even have a JSA claim, because i was actually on ESA .so you see i never made a new claim for ESA at that point because as far as i was concerned i was on JSA as i had signed the paperwork and been given a job coach etc.
I then had an ESA payments from the 21st june onwards untill i failed the medical in september.

fumin37

Neil cr with the greatest of respect i do not owe you,or anyone else reading an explaination.
I am concerned with trying to get to the bottom of my ESA issues so i wont be answering any more questions on that particular issue .

NeilCr

fumin37 wrote: »

Neil cr with the greatest of respect i do not owe you,or anyone else reading an explaination.
I am concerned with trying to get to the bottom of my ESA issues so i wont be answering any more questions on that particular issue .

Fine

I understand that but you also need to realise just what you are suggesting re CAB and how they interact with other organisations like DWP

I’ll take it from your reluctance to clarify that the CAB worker was not aware that you had set up the record function on your phone and was acting in good faith. I hope you are clearer with them in future.

fumin37

Neil cr again truly the greatest of respect to you ,And i do hear your concerns ,but i resent what you are saying as it is completely innacurate .please do not accuse me, or imply that i am dishonest as that absaloutely couldnt be further from the truth .There was NO premeditation involved and nothing covert or sneeky, no deeply personal info shared. Its just a simple call back that i needed clarifacation for in order to be able to log in writing what was said by the dwp on my own telephone /property that no longer exists .bearing in mind also, that i had spent the entire morning phoning dwp trying to get hold of the info epitome had suggested to me i try to get, and spending most of my life going up and down from the cab its not surprising i just so happened to get a call back while i was in the office .
There is serious corruption that goes on all over the place,people being treated extremely badly,things being said and not said etc etc in the world ,and you are concerned about a 5 minute personal phone call made to me that no one will ever,ever hear.plus a maximum of two or three simple questions my worker asked for me ,that i couldnt wrap my head around and remember to ask at that particular moment in time Its hardly crime of the century.

Ames

Fumin- I don't think you realise that you're making a serious allegation of misconduct against CAB. One that could damage their relationship with the DWP and stop other people getting help. It also damages their reputation.

Unless the person from the DWP who was on the phone knew it was being recorded your CAB worker was breaking the rules. That's why Neil and others are concerned.

Did your CAB worker know that that specific call was being recorded, or had you just mentioned in the past that you automatically record all calls?