Received Claim Form - Need help!!!

Grap3fruit

Hi All

Any last criticisms on my defence before handing it in? I don't want to do it unless I'm confident!

claxtome

My thoughts off the top of my head.
Did you receive a PCN in the post OR on the day attached to the car?
The reason I am asking is -> If it was the former that would have effectively been your Notice to Keeper (NTK). If they latter the NTK should have come later in the post.

I was just wondering have you got any POFA 2012 breaches for when they got your Keeper details.
Google Protection of Freedom Act 2012 and look at Schedule 4 and check for any breaches.

Only other suggestion is - have you looked up and read the IPC CoP guidleines - maybe you can quote some further breaches from this page by Cicking on the link in the 'Code of Practice' section->
https://theipc.info/accredited-operator-scheme

Grap3fruit

Hi

PCN was attached to car in the yellow sticky bag.

I don't quite understand what you mean with the POFA 2012 breaches, I assume they just contacted the DVLA to get the details? Are they not allowed to do this or something?

I've looked at the following;

legislation(dot)gov(dot)uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted

And I can't really see anything that points out to me... It's all written in such a formal way that I genuinely struggle to understand it but I'm not entirely sure there's anything I can add to my defence from this.

I'll take a look over the IPC guidelines as they seem a little easier for me to understand. Thanks four your help

claxtome

I don't quite understand what you mean with the POFA 2012 breaches, I assume they just contacted the DVLA to get the details? Are they not allowed to do this or something?

POFA Schedule 4 is what gives the PPC the power to contact DVLA to get details of the keeper and send a Notice to the Keeper relating to the PCN. The POFA sets out the regulations that they must follow to do this.

You are appealing as the keeper (not seen you mention who was the driver in your defence). The main advantage of this is you can check to make sure they issued the NTK to you as per Schedule 4 of POFA 2012.

I know it is late in the day but if you have the NTK to hand you can check they have done this as per POFA Schedule 4 (I know it is not easy reading)->
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted

You could just say in your defence:
"The Notice to Keeper was not issued as per Schedule 4 of the POFA Act 2012"
And add the details of what the breaches are at your Witness Statement stage where the NTK could be exhibited as evidence.

Just a suggestion - as a lot of cases are thrown out when appealing as the keeper and POFA Schedule 4 was not followed

Redx

not all companies follow POFA2012 as it is NOT mandatory

membership of an AOS (BPA or IPC) is what gives them the right for KADOE access to the DVLA database, not POFA2012

POFA2012 sets out the information that should be present on the paperwork and also the timescales as well, in order to transfer liability to the KEEPER from the driver

if they fail POFA2012, then the keeper is not liable

if they know who the driver is , they dont need POFA2012 and dont have to follow its schedules either (same as they didnt before, same as they dont in scotland or in Northern Ireland for that matter , as it does not apply)

I agree that if the driver has not been identified, they must follow POFA2012 to hold a keeper liable

this is one reason LAMILAD won in court on more than one occasion

EXCEL (or VCS) failed to adhere to POFA2012

see his threads , posts and his transcript to see the gist

so fail to follow POFA2012, dont know the driver , their case fails

claxtome

membership of an AOS (BPA or IPC) is what gives them the right for KADOE access to the DVLA database, not POFA2012

POFA2012 sets out the information that should be present on the paperwork and also the timescales as well, in order to transfer liability to the KEEPER from the driver

Thanks for clarifying. Redx

claxtome

I'll take a look over the IPC guidelines as they seem a little easier for me to understand.

I think the following section in your defence could have a breach of AOS CoP Signage guidelines->

The claimant states that the vehicle in question was parked in a "restricted area". This is denied.
- The driver parked the vehicle during the hours of complete darkness and did not see any signs
- Even if any signs were present they were not illuminated meaning even if the driver did see them (which he/she did not) they would not have been able to read an unlit sign in full darkness
- a sign which cannot be seen or read by a consumer cannot form a contract. This is trite law and firmly established in the Consumer Rights Act 2015

1 final thing - I assume you are going to number the paragraphs and format as per defence layout suggestions in NEWBIE thread?

Redx

also bear in mind that if parking is not offered then its forbidding signage (seen or unseen) and so there is no contract on offer, so the landowner can sue for trespass and any damage , not the PPC for parking

also see the popla decision in post #24 here

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5711305

this explains about transferring liability from driver to keeper, the PPC failed to do so and lost

Grap3fruit

Right...

I have just checked all dates and such and I can see the following:

Notice to keeper: notice given on 16/12/2016
Letter before claim - dated 03/07/2017
Claim - issue date is 15/09/2017

I can't see any breaches of POFA2012...Would it be useful me posting a scanned image of the NTK and LBC?

I've just noticed none of the costs add up.. this is outlined below:

NOTICE TO KEEPER: Total due was £100 (upped from £60 original ticket cost)
FINAL REMINDER (3rd may, 2 months before LBC):
Claim issue fee: £25
Solicitors costs for issue of claim: £50
Judgement costs: £25
Warrant issue fee: £100
Solicitors cost for issue of warrant: £2.25
Total: £202.25

LETTER BEFORE CLAIM: £160 charge outlined with no additional costs

CLAIM FORM:
Amount claimed: £170.32
Court fee: £25
Legal representatives costs: £50

Total: £245.32


How are there so many differences in the actual charge amount? Can I use this against them in any way?

Not sure if there is any help with this but here is a picture of the sign: i(dot)gyazo(dot)com/9ebc829cf71501ab2e07c212c1f3bcfc.png

Redx

the ticket was always £100 reduced to £60 for early payment (a discount - a bribe)

its was never £60 (pedantic but true)

so it was never "upped" at all, it was always £100 reduced by 40% as per BPA guidelines for an early discounted payment

so I would not be telling a judge that the PPC have "upped" the ticket charge

the windscreen ticket was issued to the driver , but they are taking YOU as keeper to court , based on the postal NTK, not the windscreen ticket

recipients always get blurry vision over these issues , failing to separate keeper and driver , failing to read that the charges are £100 discounted by 40% if you pay up quickly without fuss