Forbidding sign, grace periods, or both?

KeithP

happybagger wrote: »

That uploads all 46 pages though

Only if you upload all 46 pages.

Take a screen print of one page and upload that.

Or print just one page to a pdf and upload the new one page pdf.

I'm sure there are other ways too - perhaps you need to ask that question on the Techie Stuff board.

happybagger

Fair points, and thanks. The PC at work allows me to upload just one, but this doesn't.

Anyway, PE's 'rebutting' of my appeal:
(see their comments on Grace periods)

here

And the "authority" letter, which isn't even dated, and makes no sense to me:

here

I have loads of comments re. their signage plan as the site has changed even with buildings demolished to expand the car park since they took pics, and the signs and locations are different now.

andytaylor

Print to PDF works in Chrome (other browsers are available).
Print to PDF works pretty much anywhere on MacOS (or use Preview).
Print to PDF programs are available to download for lesser operating systems.

Coupon-mad

I have loads of comments re. their signage plan as the site has changed even with buildings demolished to expand the car park since they took pics, and the signs and locations are different now.

Sounds good. Is the site map dated?

Does it prove what you said in your appeal, that there are 100 yard stretches alongside the store, with NO signs and no terms at all in view?

Also re the signatory on that Letter of Authority, is their name & company position given, and the date of signing?

And what I am wondering is, where in the 46 pages of evidence have PE actually shown what the store opening hours are?

We know you've evidenced that it's impossible for a driver to learn about the store opening hours from any signs or even at the store frontage, but what have PE said, have they DEFINED the Saturday opening hours and proved it?

Hopefully you didn't actually state anywhere in your final appeal, what you understand the opening hours to actually be, with times/days defined by you? As long as you didn't and they didn't, I think this is your first point in your comments. How on earth can POPLA conclude that at 7pm, the store was closed, if there's no evidence of that, from you or from PE?

happybagger

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Sounds good. Is the site map dated?

No. It definitely predates August 2015 due to building changes on site

Does it prove what you said in your appeal, that there are 100 yard stretches alongside the store, with NO signs and no terms at all in view?

No. Because a building has been demolished and no signs put up in that area. Also, the sign plan is not accurate in other spots on site

Also re the signatory on that Letter of Authority, is their name & company position given, and the date of signing?

Nothing more than what you see. No date, name, positions, company names, etc.

And what I am wondering is, where in the 46 pages of evidence have PE actually shown what the store opening hours are?

Nowhere. No mention of it.

We know you've evidenced that it's impossible for a driver to learn about the store opening hours from any signs or even at the store frontage, but what have PE said, have they DEFINED the Saturday opening hours and proved it?

Hopefully you didn't actually state anywhere in your final appeal, what you understand the opening hours to actually be, with times/days defined by you? As long as you didn't and they didn't, I think this is your first point in your comments. How on earth can POPLA conclude that at 7pm, the store was closed, if there's no evidence of that, from you or from PE?

PE haven't defined it. I stated in my evidence that there is no information on site from either PE or HB regarding opening times. There is no opening hours board etc. I mentioned no times in my appeal.

Will 2000 words be enough?!

happybagger

The photos also predate 2015

RobinofLoxley

happybagger wrote: »

Anyway, PE's 'rebutting' of my appeal:
(see their comments on Grace periods)

And the "authority" letter, which isn't even dated, and makes no sense to me.

What do PE give as the reason for issuing the PCN?
On the page from the evidence you've uploaded, they state ;

Rules and Conditions
This site is a maximum free stay customer park ads clearly stated on the signage (enclosed).

Which seems that they are relying on the fact that there is a maximum stay of 1 1/2 hours.
Strange when they know the vehicle was only there for 12 mins.

Have they even mentioned the store was closed and therefore parking was not allowed?

I would be surprised if they rely on the store being closed so no parking was allowed. Because then there would be no offer for the motorist to park and then it would be a case of trespass, meaning only the landowner not PE could pursue the driver for trespass.

As for the 'Letter of Authority', that is definitely one for your rebuttal.
There is no printed name and no title or position given.
There is no evidence that it was signed by an employee of the landowner or anyone with the necessary authority to sign the letter on behalf of the landowner.

happybagger

The reason given is that it is has a max free sray time of 0 hours and 0 mins

Which makes it forbidding, surely?
I've uploaded the pcn earlier if you want a look at it

RobinofLoxley

happybagger wrote: »

The reason given is that it is has a max free sray time of 0 hours and 0 mins

Which makes it forbidding, surely?
I've uploaded the pcn earlier if you want a look at it

Yes I saw the NTK when you put up a pic of it and did see the statement 'Maximun stay of 0 hrs 0 mins'.

I just wondered if that's the only reason they are giving in their evidence for the driver breaching the T&C's.
If so they are onto a loser as the signs say 'Max stay 1 1/2 hours'.

You can't add new evidence in your rebuttal to but you can and should pick holes in their evidence and dispute it wherever you can.

Umkomaas

When PE show 0 hrs 0 mins, it’s invariably an indicator that the input of the vehicles VRM was required at some point, either via a ticket machine or (perhaps more often) via a tablet/keypad on entry to the premises (shop/hotel/restaurant etc).