Excell / BW legal small claims loss

beamerguy

wi3347 wrote: »

Hello everyone,

sorry I haven't replied to the comments on this tread. Havent been ignoring you, im new to the site and wasnt subscribed to the thread so didnt know there was replies as I didnt get an email notification.

The county court was Swansea and the judge was Collins. Not sure if he was a DJ or a DJJ but his name was definitely Collins. Someone id like to avoid in future if im ever in court over a parking issue again! He seemed unsure of the decisions he was making and it seemed his decision was made up from before I walked into the room. Im still scratching my head as to how he accepted a letter which had no address on it as "evidence" that excell have a contract with the land owners. The letter just said "at the site" I challenged this and said without an address on this letter it could be in relation to any car park that excell operate throughout the entire country. His response was "well i think its commons sense its in relation to this car park and I will accept this as evidence of the agreement." So apparently its not what you produce as evidence its whatever he decides is common sense.

I am convinced that some of these low court judges are
wannabee High Court judges but have not made the grade
Bit like a traffic warden wanting to be a policeman
Prone to serious errors of judgements

A disgrace that a document that could apply to any car park
without an address is evidence. SHAMEFUL and no common sense

wi3347

beamerguy wrote: »

I am convinced that some of these low court judges are
wannabee High Court judges but have not made the grade
Bit like a traffic warden wanting to be a policeman
Prone to serious errors of judgements

A disgrace that a document that could apply to any car park
without an address is evidence. SHAMEFUL and no common sense

I am in firm agreement with you!

I was blown away by some of the stuff he said. Especially his overall attitude and snapping at me "you haven't answered my question" when he moved onto the next part of my defence when I hadnt had a chance to even explain the point he had just read out. If came across as if he didnt really want to listen to what I had to say, his mind was made up and me arguing my case was only delaying him from reaching his summing up. There was no real interest in my arguments. He would just sum them up and move on without doing anything about them.

He had a go at me over a few things, really blunt and confrontational as if I had claimed to be an expert. I turned up early, I wore a suit and tie for the occasion. I was polite and respectful to everyone. I only spoke when spoken to, I didnt argue or talk over people, I made it clear it was my first time in court and I had tried my best and apologised if anything wasnt submitted perfectly. He was just a nasty bloke plain and simple, that alone would be something if he was a good judge based on the evidence before him but that wasnt the case either!!

Coupon-mad

This might be the Swansea Judge who (qualified solicitor poster) LoadsofChildren123 thinks is...ermmm...not the best!

There was one male Judge there who, LOC123 said, actually mentioned the fact his own daughter rented a flat in Swansea once and that 'these parking firms are needed' because of his personal family experience. Talk about biased.

beamerguy

wi3347 wrote: »

I am in firm agreement with you!

I was blown away by some of the stuff he said. Especially his overall attitude and snapping at me "you haven't answered my question" when he moved onto the next part of my defence when I hadnt had a chance to even explain the point he had just read out. If came across as if he didnt really want to listen to what I had to say, his mind was made up and me arguing my case was only delaying him from reaching his summing up. There was no real interest in my arguments. He would just sum them up and move on without doing anything about them.

He had a go at me over a few things, really blunt and confrontational as if I had claimed to be an expert. I turned up early, I wore a suit and tie for the occasion. I was polite and respectful to everyone. I only spoke when spoken to, I didnt argue or talk over people, I made it clear it was my first time in court and I had tried my best and apologised if anything wasnt submitted perfectly. He was just a nasty bloke plain and simple, that alone would be something if he was a good judge based on the evidence before him but that wasnt the case either!!

There are some oddball judges around, more likely his
wife did not give him any that morning.

Nasty judges have no place in our society as this judge ridiculed
the system he is employed by to give a fair hearing.

You do have a right to complain about this judge and you should,
there is nothing further this judge can do to you but hopefully
maybe be spoken to as I doubt his bad attitude is not
confined to you

wi3347

Coupon-mad wrote: »

This might be the Swansea Judge who (qualified solicitor poster) LoadsofChildren123 thinks is...ermmm...not the best!

There was one male Judge there who, LOC123 said, actually mentioned the fact his own daughter rented a flat in Swansea once and that 'these parking firms are needed' because of his personal family experience. Talk about biased.

That is absolutely shocking! Hes there to decide if, based 100% on the evidence in front of him alone, a person is liable to pay the ticker or not. Should not even enter his mind that someone keeps parking in his daughters parking space! Wouldnt surprise me if this is the same man to be honest he seemed against me and especially didnt like it when I challenged the rights of audience of their advocate.

wi3347

beamerguy wrote: »

There are some oddball judges around, more likely his
wife did not give him any that morning.

Nasty judges have no place in our society as this judge ridiculed
the system he is employed by to give a fair hearing.

You do have a right to complain about this judge and you should,
there is nothing further this judge can do to you but hopefully
maybe be spoken to as I doubt his bad attitude is not
confined to you

I think I will actually. If i was just having a strop because I lost its one thing, but the way he was acting was not professional at all and his apparent lack of understanding the situation and laws surrounding it was another matter entirely.

Wouldn't like to complain and then end up in his court again in relation to my other thread! Am i able to post in my defence for that other thread by the way? would be easier for me to post it than PDF and scan it

Loadsofchildren123

Coupon-mad wrote: »

This might be the Swansea Judge who (qualified solicitor poster) LoadsofChildren123 thinks is...ermmm...not the best!

There was one male Judge there who, LOC123 said, actually mentioned the fact his own daughter rented a flat in Swansea once and that 'these parking firms are needed' because of his personal family experience. Talk about biased.

No, that was DJ Evans, whose daughter lived at Copper Quarter and there was a report on Pepipoo of a hearing where he said that Millennium were entitled to act as they did on the site because of the parking problems, and then went on to say how his daughter had been a victim of them...... this was in response to the point raised by the Defendant that the PPC couldn't interfere with the pre-existing leasehold rights to the parking spaces.


To the OP, if you want to complain then I really think you need to get a transcript to show how unfair he was to you. Whilst you could produce a note, I doubt you made a full one (it's difficult when you're being asked things by the judge and trying to follow everything everyone is saying to do that), and even if you did a transcript would be so much more powerful. The same point goes in relation to any appeal you decide to bring. Your note will carry little weight: the transcript is a proper word for word record.


You need to order it if you want to appeal. Posib are the only transcribers in Wales so if you want to support local, use them. They will tell you what to do (fill in EX50 I think is the right form, send it to the court and let Posib know, they'll then receive the tape and get it typed up - they should be able to advise you of the cost when you tell them approximately how long the hearing lasted).


If you appeal, you must do it properly: list all the factual errors he made and where he wrongly exercised his discretion. It's not simple: eg he finds you were the driver, but relies on you never having denied it when you did - separate the two, he is entitled to find you were driving, but what evidence did he base this on? If the sole basis was that you failed to deny, well you did, so he has made a factual error which led him to make an incorrect finding of fact. Also any errors of law - did he wrongly interpret any case law that was relied on?


There is no point in a half baked appeal, that will be throwing good money after bad.

bargepole

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

You need to order it if you want to appeal. Posib are the only transcribers in Wales so if you want to support local, use them. They will tell you what to do (fill in EX50 I think is the right form, send it to the court and let Posib know, they'll then receive the tape and get it typed up - they should be able to advise you of the cost when you tell them approximately how long the hearing lasted).

Ahem. Form EX50 is the one that details Court Fees. EX 107 is the form for applying for transcripts.

Also, the Courts stopped using 'tapes' around the time of the Crimean War. Everything is recorded onto CD these days.

Loadsofchildren123

tapes, cds..... they're all the same to me bargepole!!!!! Thank you for correcting me about the form, teach me not to check!

wi3347

Loadsofchildren123 wrote: »

No, that was DJ Evans, whose daughter lived at Copper Quarter and there was a report on Pepipoo of a hearing where he said that Millennium were entitled to act as they did on the site because of the parking problems, and then went on to say how his daughter had been a victim of them...... this was in response to the point raised by the Defendant that the PPC couldn't interfere with the pre-existing leasehold rights to the parking spaces.


To the OP, if you want to complain then I really think you need to get a transcript to show how unfair he was to you. Whilst you could produce a note, I doubt you made a full one (it's difficult when you're being asked things by the judge and trying to follow everything everyone is saying to do that), and even if you did a transcript would be so much more powerful. The same point goes in relation to any appeal you decide to bring. Your note will carry little weight: the transcript is a proper word for word record.


You need to order it if you want to appeal. Posib are the only transcribers in Wales so if you want to support local, use them. They will tell you what to do (fill in EX50 I think is the right form, send it to the court and let Posib know, they'll then receive the tape and get it typed up - they should be able to advise you of the cost when you tell them approximately how long the hearing lasted).


If you appeal, you must do it properly: list all the factual errors he made and where he wrongly exercised his discretion. It's not simple: eg he finds you were the driver, but relies on you never having denied it when you did - separate the two, he is entitled to find you were driving, but what evidence did he base this on? If the sole basis was that you failed to deny, well you did, so he has made a factual error which led him to make an incorrect finding of fact. Also any errors of law - did he wrongly interpret any case law that was relied on?


There is no point in a half baked appeal, that will be throwing good money after bad.

DJ Evans you bad egg! seems Swansea has got more than one judge that is sympathetic with the parking firms then. Am i able to have my hearing for my other thread in Carmarthen or Llanelli? dont fancy Mr Evans or god forbid the same judge as the first time!

I think for the appeal, this time i am going to take it on the chin. I havent exagerated anything or bent the truth, ive said it as it went on the day and i honestly believe the judge got it vert wrong. I mean bottom line, he completely missed the whole line of my defence where i said the defendant denies being the driver, and then made his finding of fact that i was the driver based on the fact i hadnt denied being the driver.....even though i had???? so i think good grounds for an appeal. I just dont want to risk putting more money into it when ive got £290 to pay to these scum bags already. If it was a lower cost then yes, but its looking like for the price of the transcript and to launch an appeal we are looking sort of minimum of £150 which i dont want to chance.

The advice here is really informative and seems to be a lot more on the money than the advice i was getting from CAG so my plan is to take this one as a lesson in life and go into my other thread better equipped from your fine selves.

Much obliged everyone!