Landlord V Lodger deposit advice please

nnb

I have been a lodger and a live-in LL and excluded occupiers have very little rights when I have sought legal advice. Even if you have an email / SMS agreement, I have always been told that things are in favour of the live-in LL.

As a LI-LL, I was actually advised that my 'written agreements' (ie a clear contract style email; or any SMS etc) only needs to be acknowledged (replied to positively) to be deemed signed. HOWEVER, it is also not a legal contract. The 'excluder occupier' area is extremely grey and frankly not something I'd ever touch again with a bargepole from either side unless there are more laws/certainties about it all!

Anyway, it's unlikely you would be deemed unreasonable for retaining the amount that covers the period until a new person moves in plus any re-advertising costs. I think 3 months is rather OTT and you would not have the room on the market that long.

I would also recommend including something in your future agreements clearly stating what would happen should they change their mind about moving in but have paid a deposit - just to avoid any future hassle.

I may be proved wrong by anyone with legal background or with more experience, but this is simply my experiences when I have sought legal advice as a lodger or as a LI-LL

pinkshoes

bongo_boy wrote: »

Timeline:
6th August lodger confirmed intention to take lodging.
8th August deposit paid.
8th August all advertising deleted/removed.
9th August lodger confirmed move in date of 19th.
15th August lodger changes mind ask for a refund.
16th August - full refund declined. Partial refund offered, keeping 1 month's rent.
16th August lodger provided bank details & partial refund was processed.
17th august lodger forwards the above message.

You deleted the advert on the 8th and the lodger changed his mind on the 15th.

1 weeks notice is acceptable for a lodger, so I would refund in full other than:

1. the cost of readvertising, and

2. 1 weeks notice given from 15th (of which therefore only three days of him living with you) so the equivalent of 3 days rent (about £40).

bris

You are entitled to 3 months rent, regardless of what others say. The person breached the contract so have contract law on your side.


You need to mitigate those losses, that means re advertising to fill the room, the cost of this can be deducted from the refund if any. If any one takes the room then the refund would be the difference between them moving in and the remaining time left of the 3 months.


Contracts come in many forms, verbal contracts are the hardest to prove but paying the deposit into your account is all the proof you would need, add that to the text messages and there is no way you would lose.

Kidder81

I'm with NinaSwiss on this one.

Life's too short to get into a battle over this. You've effectively been inconvenienced for 10 days. If you're being offered tge equivalent of 10 days rent, or close to, I'd take it and move on.

bongo_boy

So this issue has been amicably resolved.

Thank you for the advice offered on here, it helped inform the final outcome.

As suggested, I had re-advertised the room and informed the 'ex' lodger.

Luckily a new Lodger signed up yesterday, much faster than from my previous experience.

However, before taking a deposit I obtained a new, clearer Lodging Agreement.
The agreement clearly states the holding deposit is non refundable and on commencement of the Term of lodging is then held as a refundable security deposit.
The contract also lists potential reasons for deposit forfeiture - ie damages non-payment of rent etc.

Having taken the holding deposit from the new lodger and agreed a move in date the agreement was signed, receipts provided etc.

This is how things have worked previously, I think I was foolish and too lenient with the previous lodger. In future, if the contract is not signed then I will not be holding a room/deposit. Lesson learned.

I informed the ex lodger a new lodger has completed an agreement to move in in Early sept.

I informed the ex lodger that I have been advised that I am entitled to retain the deposit but that I can not charge twice for the same room, and I have minimised my losses by getting a new lodger. As such £200 will be retained covering loss of rental income from the start date agreed from our communications (myself to the ex lodger) and the move in date for the new lodger. This ia about 17 days (just over 1/2 month) and thus will refund a further £200 (1/2/ a month's rent). I refunded the £200.

The ex lodger was happy with this conclusion, and confirmed receipt of the refund.

I've posted this final information for those who let their property to demonstrate how this 'case' was resolved, should it be of any help as a point of reference.

I think this was likely an easy result that may not happen with others who continue to pursue.

Thank you again for your inputs.

G_M

Thanks for the update and glad it was resolved.


Just to add for next time:

bongo_boy wrote: »

The agreement clearly states the holding deposit is non refundable and on commencement of the Term of lodging is then held as a refundable security deposit.
.....

Having taken the holding deposit from the new lodger and agreed a move in date the agreement was signed, receipts provided etc.

.

The potential problem with this is that you are relying on the agreement to specify the terms of the holding deposit.

In many cases, you may not be granting the contract (and providing a signed agreement) at the point you take the holding deposit. The sequence is typically

* advertise
* applicant applies and pays holding deposit
* landlord takes up references etc
* landlord approves applicant and contract is signed by both

You need to issue a receipt at the point you take the holding deposit which specifies the terms of that deposit. That way there can be no misunderstanding.

Of course, if you are going to skip steps 2 & 3 above, and issue a contract straight away (not what I'd advise!), then the terms of the contract make clear what the deposit being paid at that time is for.

saajan_12

bongo_boy wrote: »

The agreement clearly states the holding deposit is non refundable and on commencement of the Term of lodging is then held as a refundable security deposit.
The contract also lists potential reasons for deposit forfeiture - ie damages non-payment of rent etc.

G_M wrote: »

The potential problem with this is that you are relying on the agreement to specify the terms of the holding deposit.

In many cases, you may not be granting the contract (and providing a signed agreement) at the point you take the holding deposit.

I guess it depends on how long you expect referencing to take and whether the viewer wants to 'hold' the place for that period as well as whether you were planning on charging for referencing. I would

* advertise, viewings (explain reference docs needed to anyone keen so they can prepare while they decide)
* applicant applies and provides details for reference checking
* check references while still advertising (1-2 days)
* if all good, accept tenant, sign contracts, take 'deposit' which is non refundable if they don't start, becomes security deposit when they do.

Alternatively you can
* advertise, viewings, state referencing requirements upfront
* applicant applies, pays non refundable holding deposit (non refundable unless references okay and LL changes their mind)
* stop advertising & check references
* if all good accept tenant, sign contracts, take security deposit minus holding deposit already paid (and protect the total if applicable)

Dunree1

Hi everyone I'm new here, just looking for some advice. I had a lodger agree to move in on 12th April and they paid £250 holding deposit so that I could delete the online advert and save the room for them. The lodger has called me this evening (over a week later) stating that they have changed their mind and want their deposit back. I have declined four good people for the room since this person agreed to move in. I put together a tenancy agreement (stating rent price and £500 security deposit) and sent it to the person for review when they said they wanted the room but they didn't sign it. The full security deposit for the house would be £500 when they moved in of which I would take off the £250 already paid from the holding deposit once they move in. I feel in a difficult position as I am now frantically trying to find a new tenant after thinking everything was all sorted for the last 8 days. Can people please advise legally on what I should do? From forums searches I am grasping that I am under no obligation to return this. Thanks

hazyjo

Dunree1 wrote: »

Hi everyone I'm new here, just looking for some advice. I had a lodger agree to move in on 12th April and they paid £250 holding deposit so that I could delete the online advert and save the room for them. The lodger has called me this evening (over a week later) stating that they have changed their mind and want their deposit back. I have declined four good people for the room since this person agreed to move in. I put together a tenancy agreement (stating rent price and £500 security deposit) and sent it to the person for review when they said they wanted the room but they didn't sign it. The full security deposit for the house would be £500 when they moved in of which I would take off the £250 already paid from the holding deposit once they move in. I feel in a difficult position as I am now frantically trying to find a new tenant after thinking everything was all sorted for the last 8 days. Can people please advise legally on what I should do? From forums searches I am grasping that I am under no obligation to return this. Thanks

Just read half that thread before realising it was years old.


Can you start a new one please?


Thanks.

OscarFoxtrot

Dunree1 wrote: »

Hi everyone I'm new here, just looking for some advice. I had a lodger agree to move in on 12th April and they paid £250 holding deposit so that I could delete the online advert and save the room for them. The lodger has called me this evening (over a week later) stating that they have changed their mind and want their deposit back. I have declined four good people for the room since this person agreed to move in. I put together a tenancy agreement (stating rent price and £500 security deposit) and sent it to the person for review when they said they wanted the room but they didn't sign it. The full security deposit for the house would be £500 when they moved in of which I would take off the £250 already paid from the holding deposit once they move in. I feel in a difficult position as I am now frantically trying to find a new tenant after thinking everything was all sorted for the last 8 days. Can people please advise legally on what I should do? From forums searches I am grasping that I am under no obligation to return this. Thanks

No idea what you're on about, you say lodger, then tenant and deposit for the whole house.


As for returning the deposit, what do you have in writing? Because at the minute it's clear this is a security deposit (which may need protecting) and which you have no right to withhold.