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Parking Eye are taking me to County Court (and I haven't done anything wrong!!!!)
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GeorgeKnows
Posts: 45 Forumite
Last September (2016) I picked my girlfriend up from the petrol forecourt of my local Welcome Break service station (Birchanger Services) in the evening (I entered the premises at 22:31). She was being dropped there by a friend. I was parked on the petrol station forecourt for no more than 20 minutes. I left the petrol station when she arrived and drove back to my flat (Which is a mile or so from the service station).
We stayed at my flat for the evening, I woke up the following morning and dropped her back at her parents house on my way to work (I had a meeting that morning).
I worked by Stansted Airport at the time, and visited the same Welcome Break on my lunch hour the following day. I was in the carpark for an absolute maximum of 40 minutes (Maximum stay is 2 hours) and left the car park at midday, around 12:40.
Some months down the line, I received a 'Final Reminder' type of letter from Parking Eye, demanding £100 within 30 days claiming that I had parked in the car park for over 14 hours. I knew I hadn't done anything wrong, so I appealed through Parking Eye relaying the story in the above paragraphs. Of course, they rejected my appeal. I then appealed again through POPLA - POPLA also rejected my appeal by saying something along the lines of that they're "An evidence based independent appeal company" and that I didn't have any evidence.
They have given me until this Friday to either pay the fine, or have said that they will be taking me to County Court (They have sent me a 'Before County Court Claim' letter). The letter says that I will not only have to pay the fine, but also their court and solicitor fees.
This has been an incredibly stressful situation for me, and, to put it simply, a weight that I really do not need on my shoulders at the moment.
I really am not in the wrong here, and find it unjust that I'm being bullied into paying a fine. I know that there are parking restrictions in the car park, and I would not park here for FOURTEEN HOURS when I have my own parking at my flat only a mile away.
So here are my thoughts... Do I pay the fine and just get it out of the way (Which is very hard to do when you're not in the wrong)? Or do I not pay the fine and return to Welcome Break this Friday evening equipped with a passanger armed with a video camera and repeat my exact movements from last September, leave after 15-20 minutes and then return the following day and leave at the time I left in Parking Eye's evidence. When (or IF) I get the fine, I'll simply present my video evidence to the court.
Is this approach too risky?
I should add that I also have a witness testimonial from my company Chairman and Marketing Director that I drove to the office for a meeting on that day. And of course, a testimonial from my girlfriend that I drove home (Only issue is, she's in Japan until April so wouldn't be able to attend the court hearing).
I'd really appreciate some feedback and help! Thank you to everybody in advance.
-- They've Replied To The Superb Correspondence I Was Given In This Thread, See Below --
Dear Mr Clark,
Thank you for your correspondence received in relation to the above referenced Parking Charge, which was issued following a parking event that took place on 20 September 2016 at Welcome Break Birchanger Green car park.
Please refer to our previous correspondence dated 18 July 2017 and 06 July 2017 this advised you that we recently sent you a Letter Before County Court Claim which informed you that this Parking Charge remains outstanding and had now been processed for further action. This is because your appeal to POPLA was unsuccessful and the independent adjudicator found in ParkingEye’s favour.
As POPLA have now found in ParkingEye’s favour in relation to your appeal, the appeal period is over. However, as a gesture of goodwill, ParkingEye will consider additional representations at this stage if there are mitigating circumstances. If you wish for ParkingEye to consider your further representations, please include all information to assist. This may include: evidence confirming you were not on site for the time as stated on the Parking Charge Notice.
ParkingEye use Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) cameras and not CCTV cameras to monitor car parks. This technology captures and photographs vehicles entering and exiting the car park and compares this data to the maximum stay that vehicles are entitled to and, where applicable, any payment or permit that may relate to the registration captured.
ParkingEye’s Parking Charge Notice contains further detail of the Parking Event and also contains time stamped images of the vehicle entering and exiting the car park.
It is ParkingEye’s position that our Letter Before County Court Claim is fully compliant with the Pre-Action Practice Direction (Pre-Action Conduct and Protocols) and that all the relevant information pertaining to this case has been provided. Further information has also been provided throughout the lifespan of this case to make you fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the Parking Charge. [For your reference, please find copies of these notices attached.]
All of ParkingEye’s correspondence has been in line with the British Parking Association Code of Practice and we are a member of the Approved Operator Scheme. We do not believe that our letters can be considered threatening. They are informative and include all the information required to support the Parking Charge, as well as informing you how to pay or appeal the Parking Charge.
ParkingEye can confirm that we are authorised by the ICO to collect and process data from the DVLA for the purpose of car park management. The ICO have also confirmed to ParkingEye that we are authorised to collect and process data by the means of our ANPR cameras.
ParkingEye complies fully with the Data Protection Act 1998. All personal data is processed fairly and lawfully and we satisfy 2 conditions of Schedule 2 of the said Act, those being:
1. The data subject has given his consent to the processing.
2. The processing is necessary—
(a) for the performance of a contract to which the data subject is a party
The signage at the car parks operated by ParkingEye gives a privacy notice to motorists that their registration details will be captured by Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras.
“By entering this private car park, you consent for the purpose of parking control and enforcement of the Parking Contract to: the capturing of photographs of the vehicle and registration by the ANPR cameras and to the processing of this data, together with any data provided via the payment or permit systems, by ParkingEye Ltd to check compliance with the Parking Contract; and to the processing of this data to request registered keeper details from the DVLA.”
By entering and remaining on site, the motorist gave consent to the processing of their data by means of the ANPR cameras for the purpose of parking control and enforcement of the parking contract.
ParkingEye also satisfies one condition of Schedule 3 of the said Act, this being:
6. The processing—
(a) is necessary for the purpose of, or in connection with, any legal proceedings (including prospective legal proceedings),
(b) is necessary for the purpose of obtaining legal advice, or
(c) is otherwise necessary for the purposes of establishing, exercising or defending legal rights.
ParkingEye has fulfilled these criteria as data processing is necessary for the purpose of legally enforcing the breach of contract between ParkingEye and the Defendant, and is also necessary for exercising and defending our client’s legal rights.
ParkingEye is prepared to take legal action if necessary and should court proceedings be issued, the further costs incurred by ParkingEye will be added to the amount outstanding. These will include all court fees and our solicitor’s fees.
Payment can be made by telephoning our offices on 0330 555 4444, by visiting (Website), or by posting a cheque or postal order to the address detailed below. Please note that you must quote the above Parking Charge reference on the reverse of the cheque or postal order.
Yours sincerely,
ParkingEye Enforcement Team
ParkingEye
Part of Capita Parking Services
40 Eaton Avenue | Matrix Park | Buckshaw Village | Chorley | PR7 7NA
Tel: 01772 450970 | Fax: 01772 450979 |
What does everybody make of their reply? All help appreciated!
29/09/2017:
Hi all,
Another BUMP!
I'm yet to send anything back to Parking Eye. The only proof which backs my story is text messages between my girlfriend and I, and a text from my Manager at the time.
I haven't had any further correspondence from Parking Eye, or the County Court. It's been over a year since the alleged violation, and a couple of months since their last correspondence.
Any idea what the next steps are, or if they've just forgotten about it?
Help and info appreciated!
We stayed at my flat for the evening, I woke up the following morning and dropped her back at her parents house on my way to work (I had a meeting that morning).
I worked by Stansted Airport at the time, and visited the same Welcome Break on my lunch hour the following day. I was in the carpark for an absolute maximum of 40 minutes (Maximum stay is 2 hours) and left the car park at midday, around 12:40.
Some months down the line, I received a 'Final Reminder' type of letter from Parking Eye, demanding £100 within 30 days claiming that I had parked in the car park for over 14 hours. I knew I hadn't done anything wrong, so I appealed through Parking Eye relaying the story in the above paragraphs. Of course, they rejected my appeal. I then appealed again through POPLA - POPLA also rejected my appeal by saying something along the lines of that they're "An evidence based independent appeal company" and that I didn't have any evidence.
They have given me until this Friday to either pay the fine, or have said that they will be taking me to County Court (They have sent me a 'Before County Court Claim' letter). The letter says that I will not only have to pay the fine, but also their court and solicitor fees.
This has been an incredibly stressful situation for me, and, to put it simply, a weight that I really do not need on my shoulders at the moment.
I really am not in the wrong here, and find it unjust that I'm being bullied into paying a fine. I know that there are parking restrictions in the car park, and I would not park here for FOURTEEN HOURS when I have my own parking at my flat only a mile away.
So here are my thoughts... Do I pay the fine and just get it out of the way (Which is very hard to do when you're not in the wrong)? Or do I not pay the fine and return to Welcome Break this Friday evening equipped with a passanger armed with a video camera and repeat my exact movements from last September, leave after 15-20 minutes and then return the following day and leave at the time I left in Parking Eye's evidence. When (or IF) I get the fine, I'll simply present my video evidence to the court.
Is this approach too risky?
I should add that I also have a witness testimonial from my company Chairman and Marketing Director that I drove to the office for a meeting on that day. And of course, a testimonial from my girlfriend that I drove home (Only issue is, she's in Japan until April so wouldn't be able to attend the court hearing).
I'd really appreciate some feedback and help! Thank you to everybody in advance.
-- They've Replied To The Superb Correspondence I Was Given In This Thread, See Below --
Dear Mr Clark,
Thank you for your correspondence received in relation to the above referenced Parking Charge, which was issued following a parking event that took place on 20 September 2016 at Welcome Break Birchanger Green car park.
Please refer to our previous correspondence dated 18 July 2017 and 06 July 2017 this advised you that we recently sent you a Letter Before County Court Claim which informed you that this Parking Charge remains outstanding and had now been processed for further action. This is because your appeal to POPLA was unsuccessful and the independent adjudicator found in ParkingEye’s favour.
As POPLA have now found in ParkingEye’s favour in relation to your appeal, the appeal period is over. However, as a gesture of goodwill, ParkingEye will consider additional representations at this stage if there are mitigating circumstances. If you wish for ParkingEye to consider your further representations, please include all information to assist. This may include: evidence confirming you were not on site for the time as stated on the Parking Charge Notice.
ParkingEye use Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) cameras and not CCTV cameras to monitor car parks. This technology captures and photographs vehicles entering and exiting the car park and compares this data to the maximum stay that vehicles are entitled to and, where applicable, any payment or permit that may relate to the registration captured.
ParkingEye’s Parking Charge Notice contains further detail of the Parking Event and also contains time stamped images of the vehicle entering and exiting the car park.
It is ParkingEye’s position that our Letter Before County Court Claim is fully compliant with the Pre-Action Practice Direction (Pre-Action Conduct and Protocols) and that all the relevant information pertaining to this case has been provided. Further information has also been provided throughout the lifespan of this case to make you fully aware of the circumstances surrounding the Parking Charge. [For your reference, please find copies of these notices attached.]
All of ParkingEye’s correspondence has been in line with the British Parking Association Code of Practice and we are a member of the Approved Operator Scheme. We do not believe that our letters can be considered threatening. They are informative and include all the information required to support the Parking Charge, as well as informing you how to pay or appeal the Parking Charge.
ParkingEye can confirm that we are authorised by the ICO to collect and process data from the DVLA for the purpose of car park management. The ICO have also confirmed to ParkingEye that we are authorised to collect and process data by the means of our ANPR cameras.
ParkingEye complies fully with the Data Protection Act 1998. All personal data is processed fairly and lawfully and we satisfy 2 conditions of Schedule 2 of the said Act, those being:
1. The data subject has given his consent to the processing.
2. The processing is necessary—
(a) for the performance of a contract to which the data subject is a party
The signage at the car parks operated by ParkingEye gives a privacy notice to motorists that their registration details will be captured by Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras.
“By entering this private car park, you consent for the purpose of parking control and enforcement of the Parking Contract to: the capturing of photographs of the vehicle and registration by the ANPR cameras and to the processing of this data, together with any data provided via the payment or permit systems, by ParkingEye Ltd to check compliance with the Parking Contract; and to the processing of this data to request registered keeper details from the DVLA.”
By entering and remaining on site, the motorist gave consent to the processing of their data by means of the ANPR cameras for the purpose of parking control and enforcement of the parking contract.
ParkingEye also satisfies one condition of Schedule 3 of the said Act, this being:
6. The processing—
(a) is necessary for the purpose of, or in connection with, any legal proceedings (including prospective legal proceedings),
(b) is necessary for the purpose of obtaining legal advice, or
(c) is otherwise necessary for the purposes of establishing, exercising or defending legal rights.
ParkingEye has fulfilled these criteria as data processing is necessary for the purpose of legally enforcing the breach of contract between ParkingEye and the Defendant, and is also necessary for exercising and defending our client’s legal rights.
ParkingEye is prepared to take legal action if necessary and should court proceedings be issued, the further costs incurred by ParkingEye will be added to the amount outstanding. These will include all court fees and our solicitor’s fees.
Payment can be made by telephoning our offices on 0330 555 4444, by visiting (Website), or by posting a cheque or postal order to the address detailed below. Please note that you must quote the above Parking Charge reference on the reverse of the cheque or postal order.
Yours sincerely,
ParkingEye Enforcement Team
ParkingEye
Part of Capita Parking Services
40 Eaton Avenue | Matrix Park | Buckshaw Village | Chorley | PR7 7NA
Tel: 01772 450970 | Fax: 01772 450979 |
What does everybody make of their reply? All help appreciated!
29/09/2017:
Hi all,
Another BUMP!
I'm yet to send anything back to Parking Eye. The only proof which backs my story is text messages between my girlfriend and I, and a text from my Manager at the time.
I haven't had any further correspondence from Parking Eye, or the County Court. It's been over a year since the alleged violation, and a couple of months since their last correspondence.
Any idea what the next steps are, or if they've just forgotten about it?
Help and info appreciated!
0
Comments
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GeorgeKnows wrote: »... Do I pay the fine and get it out of the way (Which is very hard to do when you're not in the wrong)? Or do I not pay the fine and return to the carpark this Friday evening and repeat my exact movements from last September, leave and then return the following day and leave at the same time. Videoing both visits. And when (or IF) I get the fine, present my video evidence to the court. Is this too risky? I should add that I also have a witness testimonial from my company Chairman and Marketing Director that I drove to the office for a meeting on that day.
Answer: None of the above.
Let them issue a Court Claim, then defend it using the information available on the Newbies thread (read it all).
Your evidence should easily mean they are laughed out of court, and make sure you claim all your costs.
Then issue a claim against PE for breaching the Data Protection Act, and include Welcome Break as second defendant. A claim for £750 seems appropriate, make the bar stewards pay.
I have been providing assistance, including Lay Representation at Court hearings (current score: won 57, lost 14), to defendants in parking cases for over 5 years. I have an LLB (Hons) degree, and have a Graduate Diploma in Civil Litigation from CILEx. However, any advice given on these forums by me is NOT formal legal advice, and I accept no liability for its accuracy.0 -
Nice one. We like a good fightback and worthwhile counter-claim to get you compensation for distress, from a very nasty firm.
Look, Georgeknows:
http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/motorist-awarded-900-for-data.html
http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2015/10/parkingeye-subject-to-data-protection.html
That's what you can do.PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
Bring it on.:money:
PPCs say its carpark management, BPA say its raising standards..... we all know its just about raking in the revenue. :eek:0 -
Answer: None of the above.
Let them issue a Court Claim, then defend it using the information available on the Newbies thread (read it all).
Your evidence should easily mean they are laughed out of court, and make sure you claim all your costs.
Then issue a claim against PE for breaching the Data Protection Act, and include Welcome Break as second defendant. A claim for £750 seems appropriate, make the bar stewards pay.
Nice - would you be kind enough to link me to it? I'm new round here :beer:
Really appreciate your words. I've never been so stressed about something!0 -
Coupon-mad wrote: »Nice one. We like a good fightback and worthwhile counter-claim to get you compensation for distress, from a very nasty firm.
Look, Georgeknows:
That's what you can do.
Superb, thank you very much!!0 -
GeorgeKnows wrote: »Nice - would you be kind enough to link me to it? I'm new round here :beer:
Really appreciate your words. I've never been so stressed about something!
Top of the forum thread list, one page back from this one (use the Back button - < - to navigate there). Post #2 is the most apposite.
This has to be a largely self-help forum. Providing 'no effort' links doesn't help anyone learn to navigate the huge resource of helpful information contained here that they need to be getting on with without hand-holding by an often seriously over-stretched very small handful of forum regulars.Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0 -
Show us a draft defence and we'll help you write a counter claim to accompany it.
At this stage, however, haven't you only got a LBCCC? You could send a basic reply (and keep proof) not tipping them off about any details, but just saying that they have no cause of action nor reason to obtain and persist in processing your data from the DVLA and if they issue a claim, you will counter-claim because this barrage of letters is causing serious distress.
IMHO that then looks reasonable when a Judge looks at your counter claim. And it doesn't tell PE anything that will stop them...PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
Top of the forum thread list, one page back from this one (use the Back button - < - to navigate there). Post #2 is the most apposite.
This has to be a largely self-help forum. Providing 'no effort' links doesn't help anyone learn to navigate the huge resource of helpful information contained here that they need to be getting on with without hand-holding by an often seriously over-stretched very small handful of forum regulars.
Totally understand, thank you very much - really appreciate the help0 -
Coupon-mad wrote: »Show us a draft defence and we'll help you write a counter claim to accompany it.
At this stage, however, haven't you only got a LBCCC? You could send a basic reply (and keep proof) not tipping them off about any details, but just saying that they have no cause of action nor reason to obtain and persist in processing your data from the DVLA and if they issue a claim, you will counter-claim because this barrage of letters is causing serious distress.
IMHO that then looks reasonable when a Judge looks at your counter claim. And it doesn't tell PE anything that will stop them...
Yes - All I have is a LBCCC. I've never done this before, but I will try and piece together my defence today. Tomorrow's the final payment deadline!
Thank you for your help. I'm so glad I posted on here!0 -
You don't need your defence for today!GeorgeKnows wrote: »Yes - All I have is a LBCCC. I've never done this before, but I will try and piece together my defence today. Tomorrow's the final payment deadline!
Thank you for your help. I'm so glad I posted on here!
You only need a defence if you actually get a court claim, and you defend that.
See #8 for what you can do if you like.
The "final payment deadline" is irrelevant!0
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