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Chip & pin debit card cloning

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Hi all,
I'm in need of absolute confirmation before I potentially have a very difficult conversation with my partner.
Can a chip & pin debit card be cloned & pin number recorded so that a criminal can make withdrawals from that card at cash machines?
TIA
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Comments

  • robatwork
    robatwork Posts: 7,140 Forumite
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    Not by your partner, no
  • Lgbarfc
    Lgbarfc Posts: 6 Forumite
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    Sorry I don't understand? Perhaps I should have included a bit more information. We each pay different bills for the household, have a joint account but have separate ones where are wages are deposited. At the end of this month he didn't have enough money in it to cover his bills. So we went through his statement & it appears there has been approximately £250 withdrawn from cash machines that he uses over the course of 6 weeks that he swears he didn't do. I am of course inclined to believe him, we cancelled his card & reordered another but when looking online I'm unsure as to whether this type of theft is possible. I'm sure there will be a good reason if it isn't but I need to know for sure.
  • PeacefulWaters
    PeacefulWaters Posts: 8,495 Forumite
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    He's fibbing.
  • Lgbarfc
    Lgbarfc Posts: 6 Forumite
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    I appreciate it's possible that he is but does this type of fraud/crime exist?
  • Chalkius
    Chalkius Posts: 110 Forumite
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    I'd find it likely that it was actually him, or someone he has allowed to do so. While cards can unfortunately be cloned quite easily, to get the PIN either he'll have to have been really careless and let someone else know it, or he'll have done it himself.

    So there's a small chance it wasn't him, or that he was careless, but I think it's more likely he either did it or let someone else do it. Try and find out the times and locations and see if you remember his whereabouts at the time.
  • Eco_Miser
    Eco_Miser Posts: 4,709 Forumite
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    Yes, it's possible to clone a chip & pin card, and to discover the pin.
    The criminals put a false front on a genuine ATM, which both records the card details, and takes pictures of the keypad being used.
    It's also possible to get the pin by shoulder surfing, and the card details with a compromised card reader in shops.
    Eco Miser
    Saving money for well over half a century
  • eskbanker
    eskbanker Posts: 31,958 Forumite
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    Lgbarfc wrote: »
    it appears there has been approximately £250 withdrawn from cash machines that he uses over the course of 6 weeks that he swears he didn't do.
    Ask yourself this:

    If someone had gone to all the effort of cloning his card for fraudulent purposes, what are the chances that they'd then use it only at ATMs that your partner uses and for a set of small withdrawals over a six week period?
  • agrinnall
    agrinnall Posts: 23,344 Forumite
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    As you'll probably have gathered from the previous replies it is technically possible for the card to be cloned and used with the PIN, but that's not likely to be what's happened in this case. Has he been able to prove he was elsewhere when any of the withdrawals were made?
  • comeandgo
    comeandgo Posts: 5,765 Forumite
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    Do you need to cancel his card? Surely you just change the PIN number? When someone has cloned a card I think they try to clean out your account as quickly as possible, not take dribs and drabs.
    If fraud has taken place, contact the bank who will have photos of the person making the withdrawal.
  • vacheron
    vacheron Posts: 1,633 Forumite
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    comeandgo wrote: »
    Do you need to cancel his card? Surely you just change the PIN number? When someone has cloned a card I think they try to clean out your account as quickly as possible, not take dribs and drabs.
    If fraud has taken place, contact the bank who will have photos of the person making the withdrawal.

    Or another approach. Mention that you are going to report it as a crime and involve the police as the (shop/bank/wherever) have told you that machine has a camera and watch for his response.
    • The rich buy assets.
    • The poor only have expenses.
    • The middle class buy liabilities they think are assets.
    Robert T. Kiyosaki
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