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MSE Poll: What will influence how you vote in the general election?

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  • Closing tax loop holes is very, very easy. The same way the conservatives passed laws allowing loop holes, labour will reverse those laws by stopping all the easy steps dishonest companies are taking to avoid paying tax.

    If these companies are dishonest i'm quite interested to know how much extra tax you pay that you don't legally have to?.
  • zagfleszagfles Forumite
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    Closing tax loop holes is very, very easy. The same way the conservatives passed laws allowing loop holes, labour will reverse those laws by stopping all the easy steps dishonest companies are taking to avoid paying tax.
    What laws? When were they passed?
    At present companies will pay to use an address abroad - many places are allowing people to do this, in the Isle of Man, the Netherlands and other similar countries with lapse tax laws.
    Yes. They're multi-nationals. It's what they do. How exactly are Labour going to stop them? What specific proposals do they have?
    Companies will not lose the chance to make so much money as they currently are doing, no way. Amazon makes £billions.

    These same companies are also being given £billions in subsidies by the conservatives - our tax money, instead of being used on the NHS or education or care needs for those who are unable to cope with looking after themselves the cons choose to give £billions to rich companies who also are not even paying any tax.

    Theresa May's husband works for a company that doesn't pay tax. This is the problem with the 1% - they are only looking after themselves, not the people who are paying tax or who need help, they are being ignored and deliberately left to rot.
    Oh come on, not the tin-foil conspiracy theorists "Tories looking after their rich mates, only interested in 1%"

    Look at the IFS analysis of distributional impact of the tax and benefit changes. The richest 10% have lost more than average, in cash as well as percentage of income terms.

    The poorest have been hit worse than average too, you can't really cut benefits without doing that, but we still have one of the most generous benefits system in the world for those at the bottom. I know as I do voluntary work advising people on benefits.

    Other countries have better contributory benefits, like state pension and unemployment benefit which you have to earn, but for non-contributory benefits the UK is one of the most generous countries in the world.

    We also have far more people on disability benefits than most countries, see https://www.theguardian.com/society/2010/nov/24/young-british-claim-disability-benefits

    We're not really that much sicker than other countries. Our benefits system over the years has allowed more and more people to fit the criteria of "disabled" and it's got out of control. The Tories are trying to do something about it.

    Under Labour for 12 years and 11 months of their 13 years in power 1997-2010, the top rate of tax was 40%. They put it up to 50% just before the 2010 election as an elephant trap for the Tories, so they could claim "ooh look at the Tories giving tax cuts to millionaires" when they put it back down again. In fact they didn't put it all the way back down, it's now 45%, but the same claim was made.

    The pension annual allowance, which is an easy way to avoid tax for the rich, was about £250,000 under Labour, the Lifetime Allowance was £1.8Million. Now the annual allowance is £40,000, the lifetime is £1Million.

    The Tories have shafted the rich. And they now want to effecively increase inheritance tax on the rich through their manifesto promise to take their house into account for at-home care costs. This will hit the rich, the poor won't be affected.
    Corbyn is the only leader who has given a fully costed manifesto - it's all available online. Labour know how to pay for their manifesto promises and have shown they can do it. It will not increase our debt nor will we, the people on lower pay, be expected to pay for it, like the lib dems are saying they will get the money!
    They haven't properly accounted for behavioural change. Do they really think people on £80k+ and corporations won't act differently if they're being shafted for tax? As the IFS have pointed out: https://www.ifs.org.uk/publications/9259
    Labour by contrast is proposing very big increases in tax, a bigger increase in spending and, as a result, borrowing continuing around its current share of national income. They would increase spending to its highest sustained level in more than 30 years and taxes to their highest ever peacetime level. Even so the state under Labour would be no bigger than that in many advanced economies. However, their proposed plan for paying for this expansion in state activity would not work. They would not raise as much money as they claim even in the short run, let alone the long run. And there is no way that tens of billions of pounds of tax rises would affect only a small group at the very top as their rhetoric suggests. If they want the advantages of a bigger state they should be willing to candidly set out the consequences – higher taxation affecting broad segments of the population.
    They need to be honest about it. More spending requires more tax on ordinary people. Look at the only really successful "socialist" countries in the world, like Sweden. They have about 32% income tax, with a personal allowance of just £1700, they have 31% NI, they have 25% VAT which is on far more stuff than here.

    If Labour were promising that, they'd have some credibility. Telling people they'll massively increase spending but that someone else will pay, surely people can't possibly be stupid enough to believe that?
  • DiscountofMonteCristoDiscountofMonteCristo Forumite
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    Flawed poll IMO. Doesn't reflect the way a lot of people will vote. Many public services issues were split up into separate factors, but a lot of people will vote in connection with all of them. Thus a limit of three factors makes the results misleading. "Long term party loyalty" - or long-term loyalty to political principles, which will choose party depending on what principles parties are currently following? The poll is broken down by age, which makes sense, but the relevance of gender difference is less clear. It would make more sense to separate by class, a rough equivalence of which would be income.
  • DiscountofMonteCristoDiscountofMonteCristo Forumite
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    gingerdad wrote: »
    Really think your living in a different reality. Every company uses the tax system to their advantage. With the various write offs etc. As a company director if you don't you are putting yourself liable to not working in the companies best interest.

    As above we can't act alone with multinational companies they can play the global system. Which currently London and the UK benefit greatly from. The city being on of the largest tax havens in the world. But likely with Brexit it's all about to go to pot.
    When questioned by journalists Eric !!!!!!! said Google would pay whatever taxes were asked of it in Britain - it's just that HMRC weren't actually demanding the normal rate of tax, so Google didn't see why they should pay any more than they had to. It's not the companies, it's the tax system and possibly politicians behind them doing ridiculous, unnecessary deals with these incredibly rich corporations when they could be acquiring a lot more revenue to spend on services and reduce this unnecessary 'austerity'. It's the companies that have the money, and they're benefiting enormously from the trading environment the state provides, and no they're not going to go elsewhere if they are taxed properly, they will still be here selling their products. The reason for their non-payment is not British economic necessity but cronyism and neo-liberal ideology. That's the reality I live in.

    If I was Corbyn I'd tax them with hindsight for previous years when they've dodged the proper rate - and change the law if necessary to do so.
  • DiscountofMonteCristoDiscountofMonteCristo Forumite
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    zagfles wrote: »
    Telling people they'll massively increase spending but that someone else will pay, surely people can't possibly be stupid enough to believe that?
    Well, people have repeatedly fallen for "We'll massively decrease spending, but somebody else will suffer" from the Tories - and a whole bunch of them will do it again next Thursday.
  • zagfleszagfles Forumite
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    Well, people have repeatedly fallen for "We'll massively decrease spending, but somebody else will suffer" from the Tories - and a whole bunch of them will do it again next Thursday.
    No they haven't. People have over-estimated the effect of the cuts, not under-estimated them. Look at all the propaganda about "attacks on the poor, sick and disabled". Well they're still better off than in most rich countries. This thread is typical: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5650577

    Someone complains their son's benefits are too low. Nobody stops to think, hang on a minute, that sounds far too low, it can't be right. Everyone assumes it's correct till I come along. I see this all the time in my work. People under-estimate what they're entitled to, partly because they believe all the propaganda about the extent of the cuts.

    Everyone's going to suffer if we start imposing higher taxes and regulation on business, they already have a strong incentive to locate elsewhere because of Brexit. Less jobs, less taxes etc.

    And the NHS is going to suffer if we start taxing the "rich" which will include doctors many of whom are on well over £80k, and many came from abroad to work here, why would they stay, or why wouldn't they take early retirement etc. Doctors are already doing that because of cuts in pension tax allowance.

    But people will be selfish - they want something for nothing, something they think other people will pay for. Except it won't work. As the IFS have pointed out in fairly strong terms, and they know what they're talking about.

    Feel free to quote one line and reply with a soundbite. That's all most people seem capable of these days - I blame Twitter.
  • TArquintpTArquintp Forumite
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    It is the responsibility of a company director to minimise the amount of tax the company pays. Just like it is everyone's responsibility to minimise the amount of personal tax they pay. Would anyone here volunteer to pay more tax than they have to? (Apart from buying National Lottery tickets that is, as it has been said buying them amounts to a voluntary tax.)

    The tax system is very complicated and it is difficult to close down one loophole without unintended consequences opening another. It would be nice to think that the tax code will be completely re-written, but that would take quite some considerable time.
  • TArquintpTArquintp Forumite
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    Well actually the Labour plans for how to fund their massive electoral bribe aren't fully costed. Where will the money come from to nationalise various industries etc. It has to come either from taxes or loans. That's £250Bn or so. Some hole.
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