Asking a neighbour to sell their garage, any tips?

Pandilex

I live on a street of terraced houses, like this:

XXXXoMXXXX

Where X is a house, M is my house, and o is a garage. The garage is joined just like a house, and I also own the area behind the garage. I think it belongs to someone further down the street, who never seems to use it (in 2 years I've seen it open once). If I can buy it, it would be great for me as it joins onto my house and I could potentially put a door into it or maybe even build on top of it.

I don't know how much it is worth, or how to approach them about selling. It belongs to an old man who seems to enjoy coming out and ranting at anyone that parks a few centimetres over the line even though he never uses it. As a result I wonder if he'd rather retain the ability to rant rather than be paid a bunch of money, so I was thinking about offering him the ability to park in front of it (since I won't use it for my vehicle). I checked with the laws and it seems to be acceptable to block a driveway if you have permission from the owner. He could then continue to rant at people that steal encroach on his spot. Sounds ridiculous I know but I am trying to maximise my chances of him agreeing.

I can't look it up on the land registry as it doesn't have a house number, and it doesn't appear on the postcode search. I want to ensure it still does belong to this guy and he hasn't already shifted it!

My questions are:

- How can I find out exactly who it belongs to / information about it?
- How can I ascertain the value of it?
- What's the best approach for talking to the owner? I thought about drafting a letter saying "Hi I am interested in buying your garage please contact me to discuss" and then delivering it in person, so I can mention my desire but not put them on the spot to respond.

Any advice welcome many thanks.

Guest101

Pandilex wrote: »

I live on a street of terraced houses, like this:

XXXXoMXXXX

Where X is a house, M is my house, and o is a garage. The garage is joined just like a house, and I also own the area behind the garage. I think it belongs to someone further down the street, who never seems to use it (in 2 years I've seen it open once). If I can buy it, it would be great for me as it joins onto my house and I could potentially put a door into it or maybe even build on top of it.

I don't know how much it is worth, or how to approach them about selling. It belongs to an old man who seems to enjoy coming out and ranting at anyone that parks a few centimetres over the line even though he never uses it. As a result I wonder if he'd rather retain the ability to rant rather than be paid a bunch of money, so I was thinking about offering him the ability to park in front of it (since I won't use it for my vehicle). I checked with the laws and it seems to be acceptable to block a driveway if you have permission from the owner. He could then continue to rant at people that steal encroach on his spot. Sounds ridiculous I know but I am trying to maximise my chances of him agreeing. - It's a bit unclear, but I would suggest you wouldn't own that land so he couldn't park there anyway. I am however presuming you're suggesting he parks in front of the dropped kerb

I can't look it up on the land registry as it doesn't have a house number, and it doesn't appear on the postcode search. I want to ensure it still does belong to this guy and he hasn't already shifted it!

My questions are:

- How can I find out exactly who it belongs to / information about it?
- How can I ascertain the value of it?
- What's the best approach for talking to the owner? I thought about drafting a letter saying "Hi I am interested in buying your garage please contact me to discuss" and then delivering it in person, so I can mention my desire but not put them on the spot to respond.

Any advice welcome many thanks.

Try tea and cake as an opener

EachPenny

Pandilex wrote: »

It belongs to an old man who seems to enjoy coming out and ranting at anyone that parks a few centimetres over the line even though he never uses it. As a result I wonder if he'd rather retain the ability to rant ...so I was thinking about offering him the ability to park in front of it (since I won't use it for my vehicle). I checked with the laws and it seems to be acceptable to block a driveway if you have permission from the owner.

Are you talking about letting him park on the public highway in front of the garage, or on land you (would) own in front of the garage (i.e. the driveway)?

If it is public highway you are talking about then you do not have the right to offer the space for him to park in it. It is public highway and unless a parking place has been designated then normally no 'right' to park exists. Even if there is a designated parking place, only the Traffic Authority can allocate an exclusive right to park there, and then only in exceptional circumstances.

You mention a 'line' - is this a yellow line, or a white one?

The rules on parking across driveways are complicated and governed by different legislation depending on where you live. In some areas a parking contravention will occur even if there is no line and regardless of any 'permission' given by the adjacent landowner.

I'd agree with the tea and cake idea, but if he is the kind of person who enjoys a rant then be prepared for him to accuse you of putting poison in his tea.

Pandilex

Section 86 of the traffic management act:

In a special enforcement area a vehicle must not be parked on the carriageway
adjacent to a footway, cycle track or verge where—
(a) the footway, cycle track or verge has been lowered to meet the level of
the carriageway for the purpose of—
(i) assisting pedestrians crossing the carriageway,
(ii) assisting cyclists entering or leaving the carriageway, or
(iii) assisting vehicles entering or leaving the carriageway across the
footway, cycle track or verge; or
(b) the carriageway has, for a purpose within paragraph (a)(i) to (iii), been
raised to meet the level of the footway, cycle track or verge.
This is subject to the following exceptions.

The second exception is where the vehicle is parked outside residential
premises by or with the consent (but not consent given for reward) of the
occupier of the premises.


There are two lines perpendicular to mark the area in front of the garage you cannot park in, but not horizontal along the road indicating no parking.

That is only a last resort, anyway, if he insists he needs a place to park.

[Deleted User]

Find out who the garage really belongs to? If it's already in your garden and attached to your house, could it perhaps originally belonged to your property, and might still do if there are no Land Registry records. Maybe a previous owner many moons ago rented it out to this old chap down the street.

AdrianC

Pandilex wrote: »

I can't look it up on the land registry as it doesn't have a house number, and it doesn't appear on the postcode search. I want to ensure it still does belong to this guy and he hasn't already shifted it!

If it was registered with the LR, then it would appear as "Land adjoining", or similar phrasing.

The fact it doesn't show suggests it's unregistered - which would tie with the description of the owner.

I think you need to work on a way to get him onside over it - he's clearly, umm, individualistic so who knows what will appeal to him...

hazyjo

And what would happen if you sell (or die!)? Presumably any right you might agree would be worthless. Tricky one.


When you say 'old', how old are we talking? Not thinking so much of him croaking it (I'm a morbid soul today!), but how much longer he might be driving? The thought of a few grand in his pocket might be very appealing. I'm not sure I'd do the face-to-face thing straight away, but would suggest something about him popping round or you to him to discuss selling his garage to give him time to think about it rather than him automatically being defensive.


Jx

teddysmum

If this is referring to old Edwwardian/Victorian type properties, it will be like the situation of the house I was raised in.


We lived at number 20 ,the end of a terrace of 10 houses. There had originally been a gap and ten 22 onwards formed a longer terrace.


Before the 1940's when my parents moved in,a stable for cart horses was put in the space and by the time I was born, the horses were long gone (except for the horse shoe over the back entrance , there to this day) and the building used by a pottery wholesaler, followed by a number of other businesses.


It never belonged to any house occupant,from1940 onwards (anyway) and could have been use as a garage had the large doors opened onto the street instead of into the 'backs'.


The buildings walls directly join the adjacent properties , but no extra storey could be added, as it is an add-on, with insufficient foundation and strength.

EachPenny

The TMA S86 only applies in special enforcement areas - do you know if your street is included within one? It is up to the Local Authority to apply to create a SEA and not all have. Furthermore, the exceptions under S86 only apply to the contravention type specified by S86 - it is not permissive legislation which automatically allows parking in the circumstances listed in the exceptions. For example the offence of obstruction may still apply.

The situation will be complicated by the fact the gentleman has a history of ranting at other people. As soon as it becomes known that you have 'authorised' him to park in that position you can bet that people previously ranted at will feel entitled to park there too. If S86 is applicable, then the enforcement authority could issue penalties to people other than the gentleman who park there, but from the point of view of the authority, this will be a rat's nest to deal with and they will either refuse to do any enforcement, or else dispute the gentleman's sole 'right' to park there.

As the gentleman will be relying on your ongoing consent for him to park there, you can expect him to want a legally binding agreement to be entered into as part of the sale of the garage. I'm not sure either of you could be sufficiently confident that such an agreement would not be regarded as "consent given for reward" if a case went to the relevant parking appeals service.

If I was the gentleman I would not see any promise or offer you made me regarding future parking arrangements as secure - your only hope as others have suggested is if he is considering giving up driving.

Pandilex wrote: »

There are two lines perpendicular to mark the area in front of the garage you cannot park in, but not horizontal along the road indicating no parking.

Unless the two perpendicular lines form the ends of 'boxes' demarcating permitted parking places then they have no lawful meaning - they are at best advisory and at worst unlawful and an aggrieved neighbour could point out to the council that they have placed an unauthorised mark on the highway. Again, this would be a rat's nest the Council won't want to get into.

In negotiating with the gentleman I wouldn't mention anything about alternative parking arrangements - as soon as you do it will raise his expectations of the value of the deal, and if you cannot deliver he will either back out or else demand more money.

If parking on the street is really that bad he may also be canny enough to put the garage up for sale on the open market to see who is willing to stump up the most for the benefit of reserved parking.

Pandilex

I believe in this case, the houses were bombed in the war and rebuilt and I think maybe there was a gap, which eventually some enterprising soul built a garage in, not sure though. It didn't appear on any of my records so it's definitely not part of the property, although maybe it once was since I own the land behind it, basically my garden extends around the back and someone built an extension there too so my property is basically an L shape.

This building is basically a roof between two walls so my guessing would be to build an extension that significant reinforcement would be required but I'm no builder!

I don't know if my area is an SEA but I read somewhere that the council uses this law to determine it - anyway I guess all I'd need to do is talk to the council and see what they say about it as they'll have the final word either way I guess. I'd put a sign up saying no parking except [reg number], I've seen other people do that across the road although whether it is listened to I don't know.

I think you're right and I should ignore that and just go for a pure monetary transaction.

I would definitely like to get the land registry records before I proceed though, but I'm not sure how, perhaps I can phone them up and ask for advice.

Many thanks for all the replies.

tealady

Hi have you looked on the map search bit of land registry. It is free to look at (handy for bits of land without addresses). If you then find the garage it may give a title number, that is £3;to download.
HTH