Query about new drive

lovelldr

Hi guys.

Hopefully someone could help us out with this.

We're looking to create a second driveway on our front by removing the grass which is in front of the house, tarmacing over it, and placing further grass where we currently have shrubs (which are bloody awful!).

Anyway, I was just wondering whether we would be allowed to do this according to the land registry transfer and the restrictive covenents in it. We have emailed the council, who said that it should be ok etc (whether they fully looked into I don't know, but at least they said it should be ok). But looking through the covenents, there is one particular paragraph I am unsure about (it appears to be the only one which mentions landscape):

Not to permit any alteration of or addition to the walls and landscaped areas within the Property adjoining the Driveway without the consent of the owners lessees occupiers for the time being of any part of the Development and to maintain the same in a neat and tidy condition at the Transferee's own cost

Am I right in thinking that means we are not allowed to alter the walls and landscaped areas of our neighbours driveway and area? Or have I misinterpreted? Would that stop us from altering our grass? Everything else I can see mentions about altering the building, not the landscape. That was the only clause about the landscape. The other thing which bothered me, was that it mentions not being able to work within 3 meters of sewege/drains etc. Where would we be able to find out where there are any of these? And also whether the gas/electric/phone etc runs under where we propose to do the works?!

I've included a picture of the layout for you to see. We're the end of a terraced house. The green is grass, brown soil/shrubs, white is access path, grey is the tarmac and red the actual house.

Look forward to any responses

Many thanks,

David

Gorgeous_George

Covenants are rarely enforced.

What do your neighbours think? Less cars on the roadway has to be a good thing but I hate tarmac.



GG

lovelldr

u don't wanna know what our neighbours think! Nor what we think of them!

Basically, this is being done because the neighbour directly next door is being a huge pitb! We are currently parking one of our cars on an "access road", and she is moaning because it's apparantly in her way, even though she has loads of space.

We've spent the last few weeks trying to get quotes and sort things out (without mentioning the builders coming along and messing up our plans too), but today she came with a formal letter complaining about it! So I wouldn't think the neighbours would mind! Plus, we're having it tarmacced to go with the current drive we have and the rest of access way.

But seeing as you say covenants are rarely enforced, do you think the covenent about the accessway where we park being available at all times would be enforced? Or would we be best to do this just to !!!!!! with the neighbour?

Gorgeous_George

Depends what the access is for. Is it access to a shared area or access for emergency vehicles?

I'd go ahead with the drive and get the kerbs lowered and white lines painted as appropriate.

GG

lovelldr

tbh, it isn't access to anywhere in particular. Its shaped as in a layout for a turning point for us to reverse our car into our drive (we live at the end of a small close). But the neighbours say they need access to it for reversing their car into their drive (which is crap, because there is plenty of room for them to reverse it in, even with a car parked there). So I would assume it's mainly access for emergency vehicles (although not stated) and just to have some point to it.

Guess we'll just get a solicitor to look over the terms and covenents etc to see if we would be ok to go ahead and do it, just to be on the safe side (there goes another 80-odd quid gone )

Cheers for the help (still post people if you have a view though )

Debt_Free_Chick

lovelldr wrote: »

Anyway, I was just wondering whether we would be allowed to do this according to the land registry transfer and the restrictive covenents in it. We have emailed the council, who said that it should be ok etc (whether they fully looked into I don't know, but at least they said it should be ok).

The Council's comments have nothing to do with the covenants in the deeds - the Council don't even know what covenants are in the deeds and even if you told them, it's nothing to do with them. They are only commenting from a Planning point of view. Covenants are private agreements between two or more parties, in which the Council is not involved (unless, of course, the Covenant was imposed by the Council, which would be highly unusual, unless the Council was the original owner of the land.

But looking through the covenents, there is one particular paragraph I am unsure about (it appears to be the only one which mentions landscape):

Not to permit any alteration of or addition to the walls and landscaped areas within the Property adjoining the Driveway without the consent of the owners lessees occupiers for the time being of any part of the Development and to maintain the same in a neat and tidy condition at the Transferee's own cost

Am I right in thinking that means we are not allowed to alter the walls and landscaped areas of our neighbours driveway and area?

That's how I read it. You are intending to alter the landscaped area adjoining the driveway by tarmac-ing it over.

In theory, you should get permission from whomever gave the covenant - likely to be the original development. However, such covenants are usually only imposed until the development is completed - how old is the property?

As GG says, even if you go ahead without permission, the covenant is unlikely to be enforced. But it's a risk you run, especially as your awkward neighbour probably has the same covenant and may complain to the developer.

Which party gave the covenant?

lovelldr

Sorry for dragging up this old thread again, but seems like our lovely neighbours are still being pains!

Updated story is that we've been waiting to hear back from the solicitor. With all the royal mail strikes, it's meant that it's taken forever for our cheque to get through to our solicitor, the solicitor to get the documents etc etc. We're still waiting to hear from the solictor now!

Anyway, last night, we had someone roud just to help out with some stuff, and they parked in front of our drive (which did not go in front of their drive at all), and the neighbours basically went out for a drive (which I'm sure was not necessary, just so that they then had to come back and park it), and then because they couldn't use a turning circle to reverse into their drive blocked our guests in. Anyway, went to speak to them to say sorry for being in their way (when we've nothing to be sorry about really, but just trying to keep the peace), when (in a very rude and abrubt manner) he turned round saying "so what's going on with that over there then" pointing to our car park in the 'turning circle'.

So I told him that basically we were still waiting for the solicitors to get back in touch with us, and because of all the postal strikes it's taken quite a while (all we're waiting for from the solictor is confirmation of whether we'd be breaking any of the covenants or anything).

Anyway, this morning, my partner was just clearing a few things in the garage, and they came out, so couldn't really keep away from them, and said sorry again for last night. Anyway, they got talking, and told us that basically we'd be hearing from their solicitor about it! So I'm guessing that they were basically thinking that we were trying to get out of it and getting on to the solicitor to find a way that we could still park there or something. I've no idea what they're thinking, but my guess!

Thing is, I've read everywhere that these restrictive covenents aren't usually enforced, and that it's just something the builders put in place to try and make it look better for them for selling on the properties left?! So, where would we stand if they've gone to see a solicitor? We're now getting worried that they're getting the solicitor involved, and basically going to try sueing us or something?!

I mean, it's only a parking spot, which has no influence on them at all, and they're creating the biggest bloody fuss in the world over it! Basically, because they don't like us!

So what can we do about it?

PS Sorry Debt_Free_chick for not getting back to you earlier (had forgotten about this post because of other things), but the covenents were all put in place by the builders (as far as I know)...