MSE News:MSE investigation reveals John Lewis IS 'knowingly undersold'

MSE_Martin

I hardly dare say this here, after Martin has commented on the thread himself.

I look forward to hearing that Moneysavingexpert's much repeated slogan has come true, that one of its Big Switch gas and electric deals is actually "cheaper than the cheapest" in all supply areas at once, or even just in mine for the first time ever.

I've pointed out in the past, after doing a comparison at lots of postcodes, that one of these deals was actually only the cheapest in 8 out of the 14 supply areas.

A staff member on here then started slagging off my existing supplier (which at the time was cheapest in the other 6 areas), rather than acknowledge or undertake to check the facts of what I had said, or consider asking the nominated supplier for feedback.

Another time, MSE fervour for the subject, based on the fact that two-thirds of people do not switch to cheaper fixed tariffs, and that these people will definitely save money if encouraged to act, emerges very clearly, but again this evangelism does not make the slogan itself substantively true.

You make an interesting point and certainly were we to simply give you a link to click and get that tariff as some collective providers do I think you'd have a point. However when we use that phrase we always in the large print explanation in the email

1) qualify that is based on someone on the typical usage
2) we always say that we make you go through a comparison because your exact winner depends on region and usage and our tariff doesn't always win

And then we do a comparison and show people how it compares. No one get can the tariff without seeing how it compares; and our comparison is whole of market.

I think that is an appropriate and fair way to behave. And certainly ensures no one gets the tariff if it isn't right for them.

boatman

MSE_Martin wrote: »

You make an interesting point and certainly were we to simply give you a link to click and get that tariff as some collective providers do I think you'd have a point. However when we use that phrase we always in the large print explanation in the email

1) qualify that is based on someone on the typical usage
2) we always say that we make you go through a comparison because your exact winner depends on region and usage and our tariff doesn't always win

And then we do a comparison and show people how it compares. No one get can the tariff without seeing how it compares; and our comparison is whole of market.

I think that is an appropriate and fair way to behave. And certainly ensures no one gets the tariff if it isn't right for them.

Don't know who this Martin bloke is but he's in the wrong discussion thread, this is John Lewis don't you know ;-)

redux

MSE_Martin wrote: »

You make an interesting point and certainly were we to simply give you a link to click and get that tariff as some collective providers do I think you'd have a point. However when we use that phrase we always in the large print explanation in the email

1) qualify that is based on someone on the typical usage
2) we always say that we make you go through a comparison because your exact winner depends on region and usage and our tariff doesn't always win

And then we do a comparison and show people how it compares. No one get can the tariff without seeing how it compares; and our comparison is whole of market.

I think that is an appropriate and fair way to behave. And certainly ensures no one gets the tariff if it isn't right for them.

Thanks for the reply.

I know that, and I've had some similar discussion before, and it was during one episode that I did those searches at average usage in all areas.

What you say is a fair way to behave, but it has however turned out that not one of these collective deals has ever come out well here, except one that was second cheapest for a couple of days until others produced their next round.

Why some suppliers compete well in some but not all areas might be worth asking them about, but perhaps there wouldn't be a straight answer, rather blanded out like some of the JL responses some people have quoted here.

Froggitt

Pincher wrote: »

Never knowingly undersold means you can get the difference back if you could have bought it cheaper elsewhere, not John Lewis should pro-actively drop their prices.

These days, the price match procedure is more stringent.

You inform John Lewis that there is a cheaper price, which needs to be a physical outlet near a John Lewis store, not an online offer. It also needs to be in stock, not some flash in the pan promotion sold out in two minutes.

They then confirm you will get the difference back.

Last year, I bought a Bosch lawn mower this way, based on an Argos price. I got the confirmation, paid full John Lewis price, then they refunded the difference.

The article seems to be saying John Lewis has to price match any insane promotion going, which is a sure way to bankrupt any retailer.

It's just easier these days to buy at the competitor store, rather than going through the JL undersale pavlova.

Doc_N

Froggitt wrote: »

It's just easier these days to buy at the competitor store, rather than going through the JL undersale pavlova.

That is very true - unless it's a store with particularly bad customer service or an inferior guarantee. Most stores these days, though, are at least as good as John Lewis (and often substantially better).

vikingaero

No one forces JL to price match, just as no one forces a customer to buy from them. Some people will buy from JL no matter the price. For those customers that are price sensitive JL are offering the NKU guarantee (subject to T&C's etc) to encourage people to buy from them. For JL to renege on that is fraudulent and/or negligent.

vikingaero

I've had a read of the Disqus comments attached to the article. It seems that supporters of JL are annoyed that you are criticising their favourite store - I like to shop there or I like the shopping environment as justification for NKU being fraudulent. I suppose its like someone criticising the football team you support. You get back the accusations of a bad article or clickbait. Saying clickbait is like a kneejerk reaction to something you don't like.... in 2010.

Interesting that a few people focused on the one item with the 1p reduction as being petty without seeing the grand scheme.

I'm not sure why JL need NKU? Most of their loyal customers will still shop there at the price displayed. Fact is that most of us will price check ourselves for large purchases so it's rare that price sensitive customers will give them their custom.

theblagger

Seriously , John Lewis is not all that nowadays, far better prices and customer service elsewhere, the one at Stratford / London is a shocker for CS

takethemon

I posted a short reference re MSE findings on TrustPilot, which received a response from JL.
TrustScore 1.5 / 10
3,155 Reviews
Reply from John Lewis

Published 17 May 2017 Dear Ian, we are very disappointed to hear of your concern at the article by Money Saving Expert. Never Knowingly Undersold is at the heart of everything we do at John Lewis and our dedicated price monitoring team proactively check tens of thousands of products everyday so our customers can be confident in getting the best possible price on the high street. If a customer has found an identical product, sold with the same conditions, we would match the price. You can find our terms and conditions for this on our website http://!!!!!!/2mcSu7O. The article unfortunately focuses on a small number of specific examples, rather than the millions of prices that we lower each year and I would like to take this opportunity to reassure you that we are absolutely committed to Never Knowingly Undersold, which has been at our core since 1925. Thanks for taking the time to get in touch with ourselves - Alan.

Doc_N

takethemon wrote: »

I posted a short reference re MSE findings on TrustPilot, which received a response from JL.
TrustScore 1.5 / 10
3,155 Reviews
Reply from John Lewis

Published 17 May 2017 Dear Ian, we are very disappointed to hear of your concern at the article by Money Saving Expert. Never Knowingly Undersold is at the heart of everything we do at John Lewis and our dedicated price monitoring team proactively check tens of thousands of products everyday so our customers can be confident in getting the best possible price on the high street. If a customer has found an identical product, sold with the same conditions, we would match the price. You can find our terms and conditions for this on our website http://!!!!!!/2mcSu7O. The article unfortunately focuses on a small number of specific examples, rather than the millions of prices that we lower each year and I would like to take this opportunity to reassure you that we are absolutely committed to Never Knowingly Undersold, which has been at our core since 1925. Thanks for taking the time to get in touch with ourselves - Alan.

Just two words: Utter B@llocks