section75

stevedulake

hi guys.
I've got a question i hope someone knows the answer to.
I recently supplied and fitted a staircase to a client. Who then decided that he didn't like the design half way though and wanted his money returned. i refused as we had agreed the design. He then took me to court over this saying that the work was substandard and the timber not up to scratch. making out it was all my fault. The court somehow agreed with him and I've now had to payout £5100.00 to him and a further £3000.00 in bailiff charges as i tried to appeal this.So I've paid £8100.00 in total, all because he and his wife changed their minds about the design.
I did purchase all the materials on my credit card as i usually do that was £2300.00.
what can i claim for on the credit card insurance on section 75 can anyone help or advise me?

[Deleted User]

Nothing, unless you feel the materials were not what you ordered.

molerat

a) What has your supplier done wrong ?
b) S75 only applies to consumer transactions.

chattychappy

molerat wrote: »

a) What has your supplier done wrong ?

I suppose this is a possibility:

stevedulake wrote: »

and the timber not up to scratch.

We don't know the basis of the judgment or whether expert reports were involved. But if the judge made a finding of fact that the timber was defective (rather than being the wrong type etc etc) then this could be useful in an action against the supplier and, if S75 applies, the CC.

molerat wrote: »

b) S75 only applies to consumer transactions.

This is often stated here, but when I question it nobody can provide an authority for this restriction. AFAIK the Act doesn't make any distinction. The CCA1974 governs certain types of credit agreement, including consumer credit cards. It doesn't then exclude particular transactions on the basis of whether they are for business or not. Of course if the OP has a company credit card then he wouldn't be covered (not governed by the CCA). Nor would he in the case he used a personal card to buy for his Ltd business - the "chain" in S75 itself is broken

Willing to stand corrected if somebody can point to case law or part of the Act itself.

bris

chattychappy wrote: »

Willing to stand corrected if somebody can point to case law or part of the Act itself.

Does the full title "Section 75 of the Consumer Credit act" help to clear this up for you?

dj1471

chattychappy wrote: »

Willing to stand corrected if somebody can point to case law or part of the Act itself.

The act doesn't define consumer other than an individual, however Schedule 2 Part II Example 7 clearly shows that sole traders are included within its meaning.

If the OP is a sole trader and can demonstrate the timber was not of satisfactory quality (using the judgement or otherwise) then a section 75 claim may succeed, but it's probably advisable to approach the supplier in the first instance.

chattychappy

bris wrote: »

Does the full title "Section 75 of the Consumer Credit act" help to clear this up for you?

Nope. (In fact, there are short titles and long titles... but that's another thing.)

Something isn't excluded/exempted just because the title of an Act suggests it might be. You have to read the specific definitions and clauses.

Note:

S75(1) states: "If the debtor under a debtor-creditor-supplier agreement falling within section 12(b) or (c) has, in relation to a transaction financed by the agreement, any claim against the supplier in respect of a misrepresentation or breach of contract, he shall have a like claim against the creditor, who, with the supplier, shall accordingly be jointly and severally liable to the debtor."

Sections (2) to (5) exclude certain transactions (eg under £100). There is no exclusion for "business transactions". What matters is what is a "debtor-creditor-supplier agreement" under section 12(b) or (c).


Section 12 defines "A debtor-creditor-supplier agreement is a regulated consumer credit agreement being— (b) a restricted-use credit agreement which falls within section 11(1)(b) and is made by the creditor under pre-existing arrangements, or in contemplation of future arrangements, between himself and the supplier, or (c) an unrestricted-use credit agreement which is made by the creditor under pre-existing arrangements between himself and a person (the “supplier ”) other than the debtor in the knowledge that the credit is to be used to finance a transaction between the debtor and the supplier."

and Section 11 states "(1)A restricted-use credit agreement is a regulated consumer credit agreement— [] (b)to finance a transaction between the debtor and a person (the “supplier ”) other than the creditor, []

Section 8 defines a "regulated credit agreement"

S8(3) "A consumer credit agreement is a regulated credit agreement within the meaning of this Act if it—(a)is a regulated credit agreement for the purposes of Chapter 14A of Part 2 of the Regulated Activities Order;[(b) excludes mortgages]

the RAO is at http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukdsi/2013/9780111100493 and defines what a consumer credit agreement is.

As I say, whether the CCA1974 applies depends on whether the credit agreement itself is within its scope, not particular transactions. S75 offers "cover" subject to exclusions, but buying for business isn't excluded there.

But still open minded about this.

eddddy

The Financial Ombudsman confirms that Section 75 protection applies to small businesses...

For Section 75 to apply, in the first instance the following four conditions must all be satisfied:

• The cash price of the goods or services bought by the consumer must be over £100 and not more than £30,000.

• The amount of credit provided to the consumer towards the purchase must not exceed £25,000, and must have been provided to an 'individual' (which includes sole traders, small partnerships and unincorporated businesses, as well as ordinary consumers).

Link: http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/62/62-consumer-credit.htm