Relationship breakdown - deposit for wedding

Fosterdog

There is no need for him to use a solicitor, they generally don't get involved in small claims cases as they are pretty straight forward and usually self represented.

Was the father paying for the whole wedding (or at least the venue and caterer) or was he just paying the deposit? Is he claiming just 50% which would be your sons share or is he claiming the full deposit?

As others have asked why did the relationship end? That would certainly have a baring on the moral dilemma regardless of the legal side. Although usually it would be a case of the money was a gift so tough with weddings there is an element of a gift conditional on the promise of completing an action, in this case marrying his daughter. If your son ended the relationship for his own reasons, and not from her already breaking the promise by cheating etc. then he has broken the promise on a conditional gift. He should still only be responsible for 50% though. Interest cannot be added.

As long as he is sure there was never anything agreed about paying back and depending on the circumstances of separation his defence is pretty simple. He just denies the debt exists and asks for proof that there was an agreement to pay any of it, it is for her father to prove that the money is owed, not for your son to prove it isn't. Also deposits regardless of what places claim and what terms are signed are refundable (although there will usually be some deductions for work already carried out, re-advertising and covering any difference if it has to be sold cheaper to get someone for the date). Her father has to mitigate his losses and claim what he can back from the venue and caterer, once any deductions have been made the most your son would owe would be 50% of the remaining amount.

Gloomendoom

Fosterdog wrote: »

There is no need for him to use a solicitor, they generally don't get involved in small claims cases as they are pretty straight forward and usually self represented.

I'm behind the times, when I looked at using the small claims court, the limit was £1000 IIRC.

Fosterdog

Gloomendoom wrote: »

I'm behind the times, when I looked at using the small claims court, the limit was £1000 IIRC.

It's £10000 now I believe unless it has gone up, it hasn't gone down though.

Fireflyaway

Sounds like the father is hurt and out for some revenge. I'm guessing because he holds your son responsible.
I don't know from a legal standpoint but morally I think it does depend why they split. If your son ' caused' the split by cheating etc I can see why the father feels its your sons responsibility to cough up the money.
I guess you need to seek legal advice. Might be cheaper and less hassle to come to an agreement though.

DigForVictory

saintscouple wrote: »

My son ignored these letters, but today has received court letters where there is a claim for £4k, this includes interest. My son has 14 days to submit a defense.

Er, and here is the second part of the problem. The first being why the relationship broke down (mindful that father-in-law-to-be has likely only heard beloved daughter's view, let alone will probably prefer to believe her to be chaste pure & a treasure.)

Son's lack of communications will have prejudiced the in-laws-to-be (even if one or both thought there was perhaps another side) so do please get son to communicate (a) with the irate father & also (b) with the venue to check he's not being asked to pay the same money twice...

Best is to encourage son to stand up & sort this with all the grace he can muster - it may be late in the day but there may be ways to avoid court & even to negotiate with a solid venue contract. Charm, courtesy, & acknowledgement of established facts are all vital & will be of no harm in any future.

tensandunits_2

I think this could be one of MSE's money moral dilemmas!

karcher

tensandunits wrote: »

I think this could be one of MSE's money moral dilemmas!

for goodness sake don't encourage the insanity that are the mse moral dilemma threads!

As to the OP, I'd agree whoever dumped the other 'morally' should pay, but would suggest erring on the side of 50/50 would conclude the matter more easily and far sooner.

pphillips

I would not engage solicitors, I would defend the claim myself on the basis that the claim form discloses no valid cause of action. A claim for breach of promise of marriage is not enforceable at law under section 1(1) of the Law Reform (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1970, which abolished this cause of action as follows:
"1.-(l) An agreement between two persons to marry one another shall not under the law of England and Wales have effect to as a contract giving rise to legal rights and no action shall lie in England and Wales for breach of such an agreement, whatever the law applicable to the agreement. "
Quite simply, the father's claim has no legal basis as he took the risk upon himself, rather than taking out insurance, that the relationship might brake down.

hazyjo

pphillips wrote: »

Quite simply, the father's claim has no legal basis as he took the risk upon himself, rather than taking out insurance, that the relationship might brake down.

Many solicitors will give 30 mins or so of free advice. Ring to check in advance - would be helpful to get a couple of quotes, lines or cases from them to help with the case, and to see where he might stand and what point to push in defence.

As above, he should have taken out insurance - either one policy, or with each thing he paid for like the venue. I would contact everyone now owed money (venue, florist, catering, etc) and see exactly what their terms are in respect of cancellation, and what insurance they offered. That would be good to know for any argument.

Jx

Pop_Up_Pirate

The OP does not need to see a solicitor for a small claims court case.

Simply fill out the court form giving your side of the story and your reasons for not wanting to pay and send the forms back.
The case can take up to a year to be heard and is a simple, informal experience.

Don't let court papers intimidate you. Anyone can take out a small claims court case for anything. It doesn't mean they have any legal standing and that's up to a judge to decide.