Government wreaks NHS pension

Number75

I do work shifts.
And though I'm not a nurse, I have two siblings in their 50s who are.

I didn't say I'm not sympathetic about nurses in some positions working full time past 55.

I said I'm not sympathetic about people working past 55.

Nurse B can plan to reduce her hours, change her shift pattern, change her role, change her entire job.

Nurses work bloody hard. But you know what? So do night shift warehouse operatives at Sports Direct - who I would think have bog all pension scheme - and for whom these adverts that some people "endure" are a good thing.

Nurses are brilliant, but they don't have a monopoly of physically and emotionally demanding work - and just like everyone else, if they don't think they can physically work past 55, they need to plan for that.

jimi_man

The original post doesn't tell the full picture. In common with other public sector schemes there exists a form of tapering to prevent this 'cliff edge'. Consequently Nurse B, if he or she misses the cut off day by a week for example, they will actually see little difference in the pension. They will remain on the old pension until shortly before their retirement date and only join the new pension for a very short time. So if they wanted to receive both pensions at the same time, then they would indeed have to work for another x years. However as the new pension is likely to be minuscule and the old pension likely to form 99% of the pension provision, it is slight artistic licence to suggest they have to do another seven years when they could leave at the normal age and see little difference

There is some suggestion that the tapering aspect is (ironically) discriminatory and there are a couple of challenges going through the courts at present. The Fire Service has recently lost theirs but are appealing and the Police have one later in the year.

Mortgagefreeman

thebeeman wrote: »

Having had to endure the unrelenting Government Public Information television campaign conning the public into contributing into a Employment based Pension Scheme the following evidence should be aired.
Two Nurses call them Nurse (A) and Nurse (B) in case of retribution by their Employer (the Government).
Nurse (A) joined the profession 1989 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55.
Nurse (B) joined the profession 1990 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55.
So what is the issue!
Well 2010 changes to the NHS Pension Scheme ordered by the Coalition Government after advice from the 'special pensions expert' meant that retirement ages for those recently entering the NHS would mean working past age 55, apparently as the then current system was unaffordable and 'unfair'.
Exceptions were made for those already having served over a specified number of years, this included both Nurse(A) and Nurse(B).
To maintain the right to retire at 55 Nurse(A) and Nurse(B) (both now Matrons) would have direct from pay Pension Contributions increased to OVER £500 per month.
So why the headline statement?
Well late 2014 early 2015 the Government ordered a change again, this time stating that any nurse with less than 11 years to serve could still retire at age 55 without penalty.
Whereas those with more than 11 years to serve would be financially penalised by 60% of contributions if they still exercised the right to retire at 55.
Yes that meant that Nurse(A) who at that point had 10 years 6 months left to serve could still retire at age 55 on full Pension.
Whereas Nurse(B) who at that point had 11 years and 4 months left to serve would have a 60% of Pension Contributions deducted if she still exercised the right to retire at 55.
Let me do the math; 15 years at over £500 per month gives a contributions of over £90000 pre penalty £36000 post penalty. This excludes Employers Contributions.
Earlier years are protected.
To save suffering a substantial financial penalty, Nurse(B) now has to work for another 7 years past age 55 but based upon the despicable conduct of Government over the last few years and total lack of support or intervention of an ineffectual Pension Regulator she is quite fearful for her future Retirement.
All the above apart from individuals details can be checked in recent years NHS Pensions literature.

Is there any chance you can repost in a manner that's not damaging to my eyesight?

stoozie1

Nurse B should still have 25 years of service in the 1995 scheme, which as a Matron, and it being Final Salary is a good annual figure plus lump sum. (S)he could use his/her 2015 accrual to pay for the early years reduction factor and take it all at 60.

Not a great solution, but something to consider.

Paul_Herring

jimi_man wrote: »

There is some suggestion that the tapering aspect is (ironically) discriminatory and there are a couple of challenges going through the courts at present. The Fire Service has recently lost theirs but are appealing and the Police have one later in the year.

ISTR some judges were claiming this a while back?

Claiming it was discriminatory against BAMEs, the real reason being that BAMEs weren't typically in the judiciary to begin with when the old scheme was in place to begin with, but are now with the new scheme. (i.e. they're claiming the pension scheme itself is discriminatory, rather than the unenlightened circumstances decades ago that led to the situation.)

mgdavid

"public sector worker with gold-plated pension whinges"
First world problem.

westv

Presumably the figures haven't been doctored.

Number75

Waaaaaaaaah

Andy_L

kidmugsy wrote: »

"Nurse (A) joined the profession 1989 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55." Is that literally true? Why not give us a quotation of the actual wording?

I suspect it didn't, but instead it gave a contractual right to membership of the NHS pension scheme.

atilla

GrrArrgh wrote: »

I suggest you try working shifts and doing the sort of work nurses have to do into your mid sixties and see if your view changes.

Sympathy vote doesn't work here.
As in all walks of life, trades, industries etc there is a wide range of time,effort,commitment put in by people.

We've all been in hospitals and seen nurses swanning about doing diddly, we've also seen those poor souls pulling their plums out in A&E.
Questions need to be asked internally about lack of parity before moaning to the public at large.