Government wreaks NHS pension

thebeeman_2

Having had to endure the unrelenting Government Public Information television campaign conning the public into contributing into a Employment based Pension Scheme the following evidence should be aired.
Two Nurses call them Nurse (A) and Nurse (B) in case of retribution by their Employer (the Government).
Nurse (A) joined the profession 1989 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55.
Nurse (B) joined the profession 1990 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55.
So what is the issue!
Well 2010 changes to the NHS Pension Scheme ordered by the Coalition Government after advice from the 'special pensions expert' meant that retirement ages for those recently entering the NHS would mean working past age 55, apparently as the then current system was unaffordable and 'unfair'.
Exceptions were made for those already having served over a specified number of years, this included both Nurse(A) and Nurse(B).
To maintain the right to retire at 55 Nurse(A) and Nurse(B) (both now Matrons) would have direct from pay Pension Contributions increased to OVER £500 per month.
So why the headline statement?
Well late 2014 early 2015 the Government ordered a change again, this time stating that any nurse with less than 11 years to serve could still retire at age 55 without penalty.
Whereas those with more than 11 years to serve would be financially penalised by 60% of contributions if they still exercised the right to retire at 55.
Yes that meant that Nurse(A) who at that point had 10 years 6 months left to serve could still retire at age 55 on full Pension.
Whereas Nurse(B) who at that point had 11 years and 4 months left to serve would have a 60% of Pension Contributions deducted if she still exercised the right to retire at 55.
Let me do the math; 15 years at over £500 per month gives a contributions of over £90000 pre penalty £36000 post penalty. This excludes Employers Contributions.
Earlier years are protected.
To save suffering a substantial financial penalty, Nurse(B) now has to work for another 7 years past age 55 but based upon the despicable conduct of Government over the last few years and total lack of support or intervention of an ineffectual Pension Regulator she is quite fearful for her future Retirement.
All the above apart from individuals details can be checked in recent years NHS Pensions literature.

ajbell

Oh well, never mind.

davetrousers

Wreaks or wrecks ?

Number75

I am a fan of phasing changes because otherwise the cliff edge approach is a stark difference for people a day apart. So Nurse B has my sympathy there.

There are two ways of looking at this though.
The other way is that Nurse A has been treated well here, by having hers protected because she was nearer to retirement age and had less chance to re-plan. That's great.

There's not many people with pensions who haven't seen a change. Mine was first changed (FS to CARE) 8 years ago, and we were far from the first company to go through that. It surely can't be wholly unexpected for A or B?

And delaying retirement from 55 isn't that bad - it was a pretty low age!

Nurse B has not had her pension changed with a forced retirement at 55 still and a massive loss. She can still have a job, and replan.

I wouldn't be happy to be Nurse B of course - I wasn't happy last year when my 4th pension change meant I went from DB CARE to DC, with ONE THIRD cut off my forecasted annual pension. But... as I said - not wholly unexpected - as it shouldn't be for Nurse B.

Of course I'd be absolutely gutted that I had just been caught. But my sympathy is mainly for that cliff edge, not the idea of a change (for the worse) in principle.

dunstonh

Government wreaks NHS pension

Wreaks what?

Having had to endure the unrelenting Government Public Information television campaign conning the public into contributing into a Employment based Pension Scheme the following evidence should be aired.

How is encouraging people to take free money a con?
How is a campaign over the last 3 years got anything to do with Nurse A and B who joined 30 years ago?

Well 2010 changes to the NHS Pension Scheme ordered by the Coalition Government after advice from the 'special pensions expert' meant that retirement ages for those recently entering the NHS would mean working past age 55, apparently as the then current system was unaffordable and 'unfair'.

The public sector pensions were becoming unaffordable and unfair. Largely the fault of Gordon Brown who grew the state significantly and increased public sector pay significantly (compared to historic levels). This in turn grew the future liability of the state provided pensions.

So why the headline statement?
Well late 2014 early 2015 the Government ordered a change again, this time stating that any nurse with less than 11 years to serve could still retire at age 55 without penalty.
Whereas those with more than 11 years to serve would be financially penalised by 60% of contributions if they still exercised the right to retire at 55.

That seems fair. It gives sufficient notice for those with more than 11 years that there is going to be a change without penalising those with less time giving them just short notice to prepare.

Every line in the sand is going to have someone the other side of it. If they changed it to 12 years you would find people with 12 years 1 month that feel hard done by.

To save suffering a substantial financial penalty, Nurse(B) now has to work for another 7 years past age 55 but based upon the despicable conduct of Government over the last few years and total lack of support or intervention of an ineffectual Pension Regulator she is quite fearful for her future Retirement.

If someone wants to retire at 55 and works in the public sector then they should suffer the costs of that and not the taxpayer.

Why do you think the taxpayer should fund someone's early retirement at 55 when most taxpayers cannot retire until their 60s (average retirement age in the UK is 63)

Paul_Herring

I think there's something wrong with my browser - I can't see or click on any links in the OP, and Google is failing miserably to find anything remotely resembling that wall of text.

Could it be WASPI related?


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https://www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/sites/default/files/2017-04/Early%20Retirement%20factsheet%20%2804.2017%29%20V2.pdf is the first thing I found even remotely related and early retirement at 55 only results in a 22% reduction, so I'm sure it's not what's being talked about.

Anyone got any idea and, even better, links?

kidmugsy

"Nurse (A) joined the profession 1989 on a contract stating retirement after 35 years service at age 55." Is that literally true? Why not give us a quotation of the actual wording?

Number75

And a question you can put to Nurse B...
The 2010 change, when she was part of the protected group because her years of service (fair, yes?) - her colleagues who just missed out then. Did she do any campaigning on their behalf then? Did she write to her MP about the injustice of only some people - including her - being protected?

Nurse B needs to remember that she has 27 years and counting in a great pension scheme. One that the people those adverts you have to "endure" are aimed could only dream about.

I'm not massively sympathetic about people having to work past 55.

System

I suggest you try working shifts and doing the sort of work nurses have to do into your mid sixties and see if your view changes.

hyubh

GrrArrgh wrote: »

I suggest you try working shifts and doing the sort of work nurses have to do into your mid sixties and see if your view changes.

Then retire before NPA and take the actuarial reduction. If the reduction is foreseen as too much of a problem, then save in a private pension beforehand as well, which can then be taken flexibly at 55 (or whenever after) to avoid needing to take the NHS pension early.

That said, if someone had an NPA of 55 before, surely the higher NPA only affects service from a certain point...?

https://www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/sites/default/files/2017-03/Scheme%20Protection%20factsheet%20%2803.2017%29%20V2.pdf

Thicko2

Doesnt the tapering arrangements that went alongside the new scheme introduction benefit nurse b?

Can you tell us nurse B's DoB?