thanks for all comments

sockpuppet

Thanks for all comments

getmore4less

Check the accounts could be a sign the place is not doing so well.
new MD what happened to the old one

Any other signs of frugality/cashflow issues.

time to brush up the CV if bonus and remuneration negotiations don't produce a satisfactory outcome.

ScorpiondeRooftrouser

It's a bonus. They don't have to pay it.

ThemeOne

If your contract says a bonus up to £3000 I assume that could include a bonus of £0.

agrinnall

If your performance hasn't been appraised then a bonus of £0 sounds pretty reasonable to me. Just because the previous MD did things differently is no reason why the current MD has to do the same. Your first step should be to insist on the appraisal being done.

ScorpiondeRooftrouser

They haven't breached the contract. if "a bonus of up to £3000" meant you were going to get £3000, there would be no point in framing it as a bonus. As said above, this includes the possibility of nothing.

The fact that they didn't add it to your salary clearly meant that they wanted to reserve the right not to pay it. It was never guaranteed, whatever you may have thought.

They don't have to give you reasons - I don't see why you think they should have to. The company decided to pay you £3K the other years; it has decided to pay you nothing this year. As an individual you can obviously ask why but legally they don't have to tell you anything.

ScorpiondeRooftrouser

agrinnall wrote: »

If your performance hasn't been appraised then a bonus of £0 sounds pretty reasonable to me. Just because the previous MD did things differently is no reason why the current MD has to do the same. Your first step should be to insist on the appraisal being done.

I doubt this would help. If they don't want to pay it then they won't.

Undervalued

sockpuppet wrote: »

Yes but things done over many years can become custom and practice
And at the end of the day it is contractual and they have not fulfilled their obligations by monitoring performance over the year if they now decide they dont want to pay it?
I think it may be a case of getting on to the union and getting them to look at the contractual side of it all...

Well you can try.

As others have said, the whole point of a bonus is that it is paid separately to your salary at the firm's discretion. Even if they monitored your performance over the year, they would still be the ones deciding what level of performance qualified you for a bonus.

You have come here looking for advice and so far that advice has been pretty much one way. Just because it is not what you want to hear doesn't make it wrong. If you are a member of a union then involve them. It is what you pay your subs for. Maybe, after studying contracts etc they will be able to find an angle that helps your case. However, based on how these things normally work I wouldn't hold my breath,

getmore4less

Sounds like the money is the least of your problems.

new sheriff in town shaking things up, cracking the whip, people are falling into line and doing the hours.

forget the money fight the hours.

if there have been promotions then not everyone is getting trodden on.

sangie595

sockpuppet wrote: »

Yes but things done over many years can become custom and practice
And at the end of the day it is contractual and they have not fulfilled their obligations by monitoring performance over the year if they now decide they dont want to pay it?
I think it may be a case of getting on to the union and getting them to look at the contractual side of it all...

I think you are on a hiding to nothing. For a start off, there is no evidence that they haven't done appraisals. Appraisals of what? It could be business performance, it could be something that doesn't involve you participating. Not all forms of appraisal involve sitting down 1 on 1. And then, everyone is right - £0 is "up to £3,000". It is contractually discretionary!

However, this is probably the kick up the bum that you need. According to you, you have put up with low pay and no pay rises purely because you got a bonus. If you are worth more, vote with your feet. Depending on a bonus to make your income tolerable is not a very clever thing to do - it simply leads to a crisis when and if that bonus isn't paid. As you now know. If other employers pay better, then go to them. If they don't - well, then you know why you aren't getting the bonus.

sangie595

sockpuppet wrote: »

We dont have a union, but several of us have been looking into it given how things have been heading, i think its time now to get the ball rolling.
I understand what everyone has said, but in that case what is the point of an employment contract??

(a) You don't have a union? So which union is going to look into this? Because it's wake up time - unions do not represent or help new members, or with any pre-existing problem. So you won't get any help from a union on this. Too late.

(b) I think that you are failing to understand a very basic fact everyone is explaining to you - they have stuck to the contract because it says "up to" - which makes the amount of the bonus discretionary. On that basis it does not matter how many years you have been given it - it is still discretionary. If you want to kick up a fuss about it, you might force them to appraise you, yes. Be sure that the results of that appraisal will be that you don't get a bonus!

All you are doing is demonstrating why bonus payments are a bad idea when it comes to relying on them for income. You are either worth a salary, or you are not. It shouldn't take bonuses to get people to work at their jobs. And bonuses shouldn't be the only way that people can make a worthwhile living.