G24 No evidence, I appealed now they've responded.. What do I do next?

youngy4130

Hi

Thanks to everyone on here and to the newbies thread! I received a debt collection letter from DRP stating that I owed £110 out of the blue with no prior letter from G24. I initially sent this through their appeals process

Dear G24,

As the registered keeper of (reg) I am not in receipt of your parking invoice xxxxxx dated xxxxxx and have only received letters from Debt Recovery Plus which I strongly object to as you have broken the BPA CoP rules. I wish to invoke your appeals process as all liability to your company is denied on the following:

1) this charge is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss
2) your signage does not comply with the BPA Code of Practice
3) you do not have the authority or permission to issue invoices at this location
4) You have failed to notify the registered keeper within any suitable time scale so POFA 2012 no longer applies

These points and others will be raised with Popla should you not accept this appeal, and you will be expected to provide a full breakdown of of your alleged loss, and your full unredacted contract with the landowner.

If you do reject the challenge and insist upon taking the matter further I must inform you that I may claim my expenses from you. The expenses I may claim are not exhaustive but may include the cost of stamps, envelopes, travel expenses, legal fees, etc. By continuing to pursue me you agree to pay these costs when I prevail.

Please issue your cancellation within 35 days of this letter or supply a popla code to appeal to them.

Faithfully


They have just responeded with the following

Dear

RE: Contractual Parking Charge Notice

Thank you for your recent correspondence.

We respond as follows :

1. In relation to your suggestion that your parking charge is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss we confirm we have obtained legal advice in this regard and have been advised that not only can our parking charges be justified on the basis that they are in line with the Independent Parking Committee's guidelines, and that they amount to a genuine pre-estimate of loss, but they are likely to amount to liquidated damages (where the issue of pre-estimate of loss is not relevant). This is because the Court’s position is that where the parties to a contract agree to fix the amount which is to be paid by way of damages in the event of a breach of contract - which is the basis of the contract detailed on our signage - a sum stipulated in this way (particularly in circumstances where there is difficulty in calculating a precise estimation) is classed as liquidated damages. Either way, our parking charges are fully enforceable and no not amount to a “penalty”. You should also be aware that in accordance with the case of Robophone Facilities v Blank the onus of proving that an amount claimed is a penalty, rather than liquidated damages, is upon you (as the party against whom the parking charge is claimed);

2. If you believe this decision is incorrect, you are entitled to appeal to the Independent Appeals Service (IAS). In order to appeal the IAS will need your parking charge number, your vehicle registration and the date the charge was originally issued. Appeals must be submitted to the IAS within 21 days of the date of this letter. Please visit website for full details.

3. Again, you do not specify in which way you allege we not have authority to issue charges over the land where the car park is located. However, we can assure you that the parking management at the car park where you received a parking charge has been contracted to us. Again, we are able to confirm that we have been successfully audited by an independent assessor on behalf of the Independent Parking Committee.

There are sufficient signs at the entrance to and in prominent locations throughout the car park displaying the terms and conditions. Your are welcome to revisit the site to view the signage, we advise you to adhere to the terms and conditions of parking when visit the site.
Our signage complies with the Independent Parking Committee's Approved Operator Scheme.

The nature of our contract with our client is confidential but will be supplied during any Court proceedings.

The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ("the Act), (Schedule 4), which governs parking on private land, provides a definition for "parking charge" and "adequate notice" of such private parking charges. The relevant sections of Schedule 4 to the Act state :

“parking charge”

(a) in the case of a relevant obligation arising under the terms of a relevant contract, means a sum in the nature of a fee or charge, and

(b) in the case of a relevant obligation arising as a result of a trespass or other tort, means a sum in the nature of damages ...

... “relevant obligation” means
(a) an obligation arising under the terms of a relevant contract; or
(b) an obligation arising, in any circumstances where there is no relevant contract, as a result of a trespass or other tort committed by parking the vehicle on the relevant land; ...

... The reference in the definition of “parking charge” to a sum in the nature of damages is to a sum of which adequate notice was given to drivers of vehicles

(when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land).
For the purposes of sub-paragraph (2) “adequate notice” means notice given by:
... (b) ... the display of one or more notices which
(i) specify the sum as the charge for unauthorised parking; and
(ii) are adequate to bring the charge to the notice of drivers who park vehicles on the relevant land".

In this instance a parking charge has been issued based on the fact that the driver of your vehicle entered into a contract with us (by the act of parking the vehicle) and our signage (which states the terms and conditions of parking) having been clearly displayed in the car park.

The Act permits parking charges to be rendered on private land, and the case of Parking Eye Limited v Somerfield Stores Limited [2012] EWCA Civ 1338 (Court of Appeal) held that (taking into account inflation) the parking company was entitled to claim a parking charge of a similar amount to that which we have charged, and therefore your reference to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 is not of any relevance in the context of this parking charge.

You should also be aware that the amount of our parking charges accords within recommendations by our Trade Associations.

As we have extensively investigated this Contractual Parking Charge Notice and provided you with the results of our investigation, no further investigation will be undertaken. Any further correspondence will not receive a response, the options below are still open to you.

You now have one of the following options available to you:

1. Pay the outstanding Parking Charge. Payment of your Contractual Parking Charge Notice can be made via the payment line: 0333 733 3000 or by sending a cheque or postal order to G24 Limited, PO Box 3320, Gerrards Cross, Buckinghamshire, SL9 8WT.

2. If you believe this decision is incorrect, you are entitled to appeal to The Independent Appeals Service , The Independent Appeals Service provides an Alternative Dispute Resolution scheme for disputes of this type. As you have complied with our internal appeals procedure you may use, and we will engage with, the The Independent Appeals Service Standard Appeals Service providing you lodge an appeal to them within 21 days of your first rejection.

3. If you choose to do nothing, we will seek to recover the monies owed to us via our debt recovery procedures and may proceed with Court action against you.

Customer Services
G24 Ltd

To Pay your Parking Charge visit 'Payment site' or call our payment line on 0845 452 7777.

DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, if you wish to continue your appeal visit our appeals website at 'Appeal website'].

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail

Registered in England. Company Registration number: 5457196. Registered Company address: Batchworth House, Batchworth Place, Church Street, Rickmansworth, Herts, WD3 1JE.

This email (and any attachments) is intended solely for the individual(s) to whom it is addressed. It may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. Any statement or opinions therein are not necessarily those of G24 Ltd unless specifically stated. Any unauthorised use, disclosure or copying is prohibited. If you have received this email in error,please notify the sender and delete it from your system. Security and reliability of the e-mail and attachments are not guaranteed. You must take full responsibility for virus checking.

They haven't mentioned anything about providing evidence. Does anyone have any ideas about what I should do next?

Thanks.

Fruitcake

If that is your real name in their reply, DELETE IT NOW!

Also redact the PCN number!

GPEOL is out of date and won't work since the Beavis case of 2015.

Did they really say, Independent Parking Committee? It's name was changed last year so they are out of date with their own ATA.

The 0845 number is a prohibited premium rate 'phone number.

You should read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES where you will find the advice is now to ignore anything and everything you get for the next six years, except real court papers.

To check how likely they are to do court, have a look on the BMPA motoring charity website.

youngy4130

Thanks for your reply!

So could they take me to court? They haven't provided me with a shred of evidence.

Fruitcake

youngy4130 wrote: »

Thanks for your reply!

So could they take me to court? They haven't provided me with a shred of evidence.

I have added some more info to my previous post. Yes they could try court, but it is defendable with help from the experts here. Come back to this thread if that happens.

Meanwhile have a good read of the NEWBIES.

youngy4130

So looks like they have 0 court hearings in the last 3 years, despite issuing 200,000+ tickets. I will be ignoring their correspondence.

Thanks for your help!

Coupon-mad

G24 tickets are nowt to worry about but are most often cancelled by landowner complaint, so do that (or retailer, Store manager, rant!).