Civil Enforcement PCN, appeal advice sought please.

plynchy

Hello all

Previously used advice from here and another forum to contest and win an appeal against VCS, very helpful.

Received a PCN yesterday for overstay in a Doctors surgery car park in my home town, offence allegedly took place on a Sunday evening, the surgery is closed at this time, but car park is readily accessible, no barriers etc to prevent entry.

The signage, which is not illuminated after dark, states charges apply at all times and to contact reception to obtain a permit if parking for longer than 45 mins, the driver was unable to do this as the business was closed. How could one be expected to apply for an extension permit outside of business hours? There is no business name stated on the signage, indicating which reception to attend.

There is normally no charge for parking at this location, hence no loss incurred by the business (or parking contractor), so no grounds for a charge notice to be issued?

I appealed previously using the 'genuine pre-estimate of loss' route which succeeded.

A small time spent researching this morning reveals CE not to be members of the BPA, so as far as I can gather I will not have the same appeals rights?

Any advice very much appreciated. :beer:

Redx

CEL are BPA members

but "not a gpeol" wont wash due to the BEAVIS case which ended over 16 months ago

the NEWBIES sticky thread does give you everything you need however

and I would tell you not to park on private land unless you have the owners permission , so as you cannot attend or register at a closed surgery you should not be parking on their private land

Coupon-mad

reveals CE not to be members of the BPA

CEL are in the BPA and very easy to beat at POPLA but not on no GPEOL!

Either use the template in the NEWBIES thread, or this one:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5612169

Either will do, as long as the driver isn't implied or named. CEL might well give up straight away like Highview did in that linked thread.

plynchy

Thanks for the pointers/advice.

Do I have grounds for my appeal based on the PCN being issued to me as the registered keeper, and the assumption that I was the driver? (as a breach of POFA)

I was genuinely out of the country at the time, and as far as i'm aware under no obligation to supply the name of whoever was driving.

Fruitcake

All the relevant appeal points you can use are in the NEWBIES thread, but you need to make a first stage appeal using the relevant template.

You should edit your first post as you have implicated the driver. (The bit immediately after "45 mins,").

This also contradicts your next post where you say you were out of the country. Please explain what you mean.

plynchy

First post edited, apologies for the confusion.

My workplace is out of the country, I was at work at the time of this incident, hence I was not the driver.

Reading through the POFA, paragraph 9: (7)When the notice is given it must be accompanied by any evidence prescribed under paragraph 10.

No evidence supplied with the PCN.

Coupon-mad

That's because there is nothing prescribed under para 10...it doesn't exist (it's there to cover future updates by the Government if any happen).

Stop trying to reinvent the wheel. This needs zero thought and is easily appealed by the registered keeper. CEL normally fold at first effort, when they see the BPA firms template appeal from the NEWBIES thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822

Or as an alternative, a version focussing more on the fact that (like Highview in the below link) CEL can't hold a keeper liable:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5612169

You probably won't need POPLA stage but if you do, a keeper appellant wins hands down v these companies who don't use the POFA wording.

plynchy

Thank you for the advice.

Not attempting to reinvent anything, just want to make sure my appeal stands.

For a non-legal type attempting to digest all the available rules/regs is somewhat tiresome.

Coupon-mad

I'm a non-legal type; never went to Uni, etc. But this is easy. But we have been doing it for years. Trust me!

CEL will cancel. Look:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5618977

Yours will be the same.

plynchy

When would be the best time to submit my appeal?

Day 26 of the 28 day period?

Fruitcake

plynchy wrote: »

When would be the best time to submit my appeal?

Day 26 of the 28 day period?

If you had a windscreen ticket then appeal around day 26 for BPA members. (IPC members deadline is often shorter.)

If you recived a NTK then appeal now and don't miss the deadline.

This is explained in the NEWBIES along with the reason why.