Next door is selling - is now a good time to solve a land dispute?

AdrianC

martinsurrey wrote: »

yeah, a lot of banter about freeholds on this thread, but the OP doesn't have a freehold, its a leasehold. Leaseholds don't mean you own the ground on which your lease sits

Which is why the freeholder may be responsible.

in fact you don't own any part of the building.

the freeholder owns the lot.

That's a massive over-simplification.

martinsurrey

AdrianC wrote: »

Which is why the freeholder may be responsible.

That's a massive over-simplification.

My point was more that a leasehold gives you a defined set of rights to use a building that someone else "owns", knowing what rights your lease grants you, and over what, is key, and hasn't been detailed at all by the OP, and until they are, we don't know anything and cant help at all.

Norman_Castle

OP. What is under the neighbours house preventing their cellar being there? If the pub was built as a pub does their cellar extend under the neighbours house?

ajgwilliam

OP. What is under the neighbours house preventing their cellar being there? If the pub was built as a pub does their cellar extend under the neighbours house?

No idea why it is this way. Possibly geography - picture a terraced row of three, with a pub on the end as well. The whole site is on top of a hill. Pub right at the top. Then three houses. The house without a cellar is the last one before the hill starts to slope down. The adjacent terraced row to this is a few feet lower down. So it's like a step. My row being the top step, the adjacent row being the first step down. So, I think this is why the last house on my row can't have a cellar - on the far edge, it would be as if some of it was above ground, kind of.

The pub a massive cellar, under the pub. The house in between the pub and me has a full cellar. I have half a cellar, the other half shared with the house next to me, the one "without a cellar".

(As far as I know) all three houses and the pub were built together at the same time and the leaser is the same and the details of the lease are the same for all of us. (That's why I said both houses are on the same lease). The current leaser is the brewery. (I could details out from the lease but I'm short on time)

No issues were raised about the lease at time of purchase. It has many hundreds of year left to run.

Am literally packing to for my trip tonight, so I'm forced into the following plan:

Write a letter to the owner saying I am bringing this to her attention as I think that this is a good time to resolve the unusual situation with the positioning of the cellar:

- at the very least, we need to use this opportunity to sort out the error in the deeds i.e. not correctly indicating the position of the cellar

- I want to sort this now because this will become a bigger problem for me when it is my turn to sell, more so that it is for you making the sale

- If we do not makes changes to the cellar, then I need to establish a formal agreement of how I access the other property to make the repairs

- If we do not makes changes to the cellar, then for the new owners and forever going forward, I need to see evidence that the insurance company for that property have full understanding of the unusual layout, and that my property and contents is fully insured for any damages/losses that may occur as a result of what takes place in the adjacent property




...something along those lines. Do people see anything really stupid with this approach? Will this be enough for her to have to show it to her solicitors?

G_M

Yes.

Stupid to rush into this before you know the facts!

Do as advised:

* download and look at the Leasehold title & Plan (£3 each) for next door, to compare with yours

* obtain a copy of the lease for next door (this may also be held by the land registry ((£7)

* check who your freeholder is

* read your own lease to see if you, or your freeholder, is responsible for repairs (and which repairs)

* and anything else sensible which people have suggested in this thread but which I can't be bothered to re-read - but you should!

And once you've done all you can to clarify the situation, I would still not write. I'd go and have a chat over tea...... (and whatever....)

davidmcn

ajgwilliam wrote: »

- If we do not makes changes to the cellar, then for the new owners and forever going forward, I need to see evidence that the insurance company for that property have full understanding of the unusual layout, and that my property and contents is fully insured for any damages/losses that may occur as a result of what takes place in the adjacent property

No you don't. You're overthinking this point. You insure your property, the neighbour insures their property. Insurers aren't going to ask questions or care about "unusual layouts".

ajgwilliam

Do as advised:

* download and look at the Leasehold title & Plan (£3 each) for next door, to compare with yours

I got all the documents I could from the links someone posted. There is nothing that sounds too different from my documents. And the Title Plan has the simple rectangle, like mine, with nothing indicating that there is something underneath my house.

I'm another who thinks you need to carefully pitch this issue as a benefit to the neighbour. Because actually it's a really poor time to be pulling this stunt when you've had years to do it.

I tried to broach the subject a few ago when I first found out. She sounded like she didn't want a bar of it. The house was rented out, so I backed off because I didn't want to cause a drama in a currently rented property - giving both her and the lodger a ballache. I thought, rightly or wrongly, that when she decides to sell (i.e. when the house is empty) would be the better time, hence my timing.

No you don't. You're overthinking this point

Fair comment.

Having cup of tea would be a nice approach, but I need to ensure (since I am about to be away for a month) that she doesn't just sell the house with nothing changing. With me gone, someone needs to fight my corner. So the original question remains: what is the way the ensure that this is solved i.e. she definitely tells her solicitor that I have an issue? The letter, as advised above, seemed like the formal way to do this...

G_M

You've only mentioned getting the Title and Title Plan.

You've not mentioned your lease. Or lease plan.

Nor your neighbour's lease. And lease plan

These are all key documents both for specifying who owns what under the leases, AND who is responsible for what (ie freeholder).

I must say I agree with squirrel, and your explanation about "a drama in a currently rented property - giving both her and the lodger a ballache" seems bizarre (tenant or lodger?).

By your timing you are about to give her a much bigger ballache (can women get ballache?).

Either go and talk to her, or forget the issue for another X years.

Or ignore all advice here as seems to be what you want to do and send your letter.