Generational Inequality

Sapphire

PasturesNew wrote: »

This isn't about generations - it's about globalisation. We had "more", others had "less" and technology and globalisation enabled the world's wealthier people to move their firms/jobs to where it was cheapest for them to operate.

With increasing technology reducing jobs - and jobs, where possible, going to other countries, this is what's left.

It's probably due to the actions of a lot of 30-60 year olds that this has been happening.

Articles "blame" the older generation, but it's a few/wealthier people, choosing tax avoidance schemes and structuring their companies to make them the most money by placing jobs etc in cheapest areas, which isn't "here".

A business owner here would rather have a new yacht than raise wages and create 2 new jobs on a living wage, by placing those jobs in countries where they pay staff 10p/hour.

I would agree with this – as that TV programme showed the other day, vast swathes of industry have been closed all over Europe (which I hadn't realised) and farmed out to places in other countries that can produce the work more cheaply. The result is dying or dead communities, shops closed and real poverty for those who were previously quite OK, but who now have no means of income. This is only going to get worse, given the growing world population, alarming increase in automation and race to ever lower payments to workers. I can foresee a world where there is no middle class, let alone a working class. The globalists only care about increasing their own wealth. Eventually, their behaviour will come back and slap them hard in the face, but it will take time, I fear.

The other thing I was thinking about the other day was the way public money is wasted, with things like the employment of 'management consultants' working to set formulae and paid £1,000 or more a day (I have a cousin who is one, so I know about this), the massive number of 'lords' and their earnings and pensions, the perks and pensions of MPs and MEPs, the very high earnings of freelance doctors (can be £350 per hour, I've heard), and also of things like administrators in hospitals (used to be paid quite modest wages) and at the BBC, etc. That's not to forget the amounts various senior people in business earn (like bank managers), compared with what they earned in the past in proportion to the wages of their employees. Fine for those who 'run things' to earn more than those who work for them (however hard), but the gap between such earnings has become far too large…

westernpromise

Don't be silly.

The world didn't end when cottage weavers were made obsolete by the mechanical loom. Everyone just got richer. When calculators were invented abacus makers went bust. Should we still be subsidising abacus factories so abacus makers can still make things nobody wants and sell them for more than something that works better?

If a job is worth 10p an hour we don't want it. We want jobs worth £10 an hour (and the solution is not to pay £10 for £0.10 of work either).

mrginge

westernpromise wrote: »

If a job is worth 10p an hour we don't want it. We want jobs worth £10 an hour (and the solution is not to pay £10 for £0.10 of work either).

What's the solution when the £10 job that we do want is transferred to India where someone will do it for £1.50?

I guess we could get the government to 'create' some new jobs paying £10 instead.

Sounds like just the kind of thing that famous socialist chancellor George osbourne would do.

MyOnlyPost

I think as a nation we are a peculair lot. When it comes to immigration and it's effects, as individuals we are becoming more inward looking and protectionist yet we don't seem to be able to transfer that behaviour to our economic activity and will happily buy from anywhere if it saves us money (huge sweeping generalisation but you get the point).

We often look for the cheapest without regard to the fact that we are exporting our wealth. This can be saving 20p on an eBay purchaese from China, going to Starbucks rather than a local coffee shop, buying in season fruit and veg from overseas rather than what's in season at home or buying cheap French lager instead of British. Sometimes we make choices because of our perceived value such as spending thousands on an overseas holiday rather than at home or choosing German built products over British because they are better.

If we support our own economy more then the whole country benefits and we pull each other up.

ukcarper

davomcdave wrote: »

I believe that strictly speaking they, well the men at least, got very valuable final salary pension schemes which are generally closed to young people and are mostly in substantial deficit.

Those young people instead save in defined contribution pension schemes which invest in shares for the most part. Not only are they taking on investment risk which many of their elders did not, their returns are constrained by companies needing to fund the final salary pension schemes the old are benefiting from!

You will notice that when final salary pension schemes were closed the young did not get a pay rise that was remotely close to compensating them for the value of the schemes they were locked out of.

I'd love to see some figures showing how many pensioners get a final salary pension. I keep in contact with 5 of my school friends, I'm the only one with a final salary pension.

MyOnlyPost

ukcarper wrote: »

I'd love to see some figures showing how many pensioners get a final salary pension. I keep in contact with 5 of my school friends, I'm the only one with a final salary pension.

Based on very litle research 1/6

ukcarper

MyOnlyPost wrote: »

Based on very litle research 1/6

Are my friends typical?

MyOnlyPost

ukcarper wrote: »

Are my friends typical?

I can 100% guarantee that statistically your friends are not typical. It was a joke, hence the grin

ukcarper

MyOnlyPost wrote: »

I can 100% guarantee that statistically your friends are not typical. It was a joke, hence the grin

I gathered that but seriously it's hard to find any facts.

MyOnlyPost

I am by no means an expert but it may be higher than you consider as I think the whole of the Civil Service used a DB pension scheme for 30 years