£67,031.92 is a frightening number indeed....

enthusiasticsaver

Treadingonplaymobil wrote: »

It is so long and complicated. The partnership is the card I had to use in August/September when I basically didn't earn anything and didn't have a buffer in place in my account (and was planning to clear it with DH's pay rise, which didn't materialise, again). It's been in the paying it off that my maths has gone wrong. Very long and boring money moving fail situation, it took me about an hour to work it out this morning, so I'm not going to attempt to explain it here and confuse everyone! Short version, it will all level out by the end of this month and the numbers will be right, but there will still be a significant balance on the Partnership CC at that stage, as expected.

So am I right that prior to August/September you cleared the card monthly but due to having no buffer in your business account for lower earnings or fund for holiday everyday living costs went on the partnership card?

You are obviously trying to build up savings (somewhat erratically) but now the savings are going to be needed to cover your shortfall for this month. This really does emphasise the need not only for emergency fund but also savings for things like shortfall in income(should be held in business account). Earlier on in the year I think you spent your business buffer on the garden but this should have been left to subsidise the summer and drop in income. As you have probably found this year all spending decisions have repercussions on other budgets. If you spend the income buffer on something which should have come from house maintenance then your income is short later in the year the result is extra credit card debt. I don't say this to rub it in, you are intelligent enough to know where you went wrong but to stress that saving for things is as important as keeping within monthly budgets and paying off debt.

Perhaps when and if the pay rise comes in you can use it to top up your savings pots for Christmas, holidays, house and car fund and emergency fund?

Treadingonplaymobil

Not quite - I didn’t use the partnership CC at all from Feb-July, it was only used in Aug/Sept because of lack of earnings. And yes to everything else - as I’ve said before, the lesson about the buffer zone in the business account has been thoroughly learnt! I’m contemplating using the pay rise back pay (assuming it happens) as a Christmas fund rather than making overpayments to the CC and then needing to use it again. I’ll wait and see till it comes in and make a decision.

Kantankrus_Mare

I agree that savings pots that you do your hardest not to touch is the best way to budget and eventually stay out of debt.

Difficult when things crop up that arent covered by said pots. I spend my life juggling and trying to put bits away to cover every eventuality but when you have an OH who sees X amount of money "sitting "in the current account.........he has to find a home for it and scuppers my plans. :mad:

Hence I have an account in another bank in my name only that I try to save for holidays/Xmas/birthdays/insurances.

We didnt do this last year and had to put Xmas, a lot of yearly insurances and then a bug*er it attitude spend on a potting shed, new laptop and something else (which I cant even remember) on a 0% creditcard. :eek:

We then had a debt of £1,800 to pay off. Not a huge amount I know but thats how it starts.

I have religiously put away for holiday, insurances and Xmas this year and hoping there will be enough left to pay a big chunk off credit card before the interest kicks in.

It wont be happening again! I hate debt.

Suffolk_lass

Treadingonplaymobil wrote: »

Not quite - I didn’t use the partnership CC at all from Feb-July, it was only used in Aug/Sept because of lack of earnings. And yes to everything else - as I’ve said before, the lesson about the buffer zone in the business account has been thoroughly learnt! I’m contemplating using the pay rise back pay (assuming it happens) as a Christmas fund rather than making overpayments to the CC and then needing to use it again. I’ll wait and see till it comes in and make a decision.

Maybe do half and half TOPM - you will manage to reduce your Christmas costs this year, I know you will. I have watched your attitude change a lot over this year. You always start by justifying your old position on here, then we all get uppity about what you are doing "wrong" and then you modify what you planned to reflect a more reasonable position.

I am confident that you can do Christmas for less than £1000 - you are already more open to cheaper stocking fillers I think, and you are looking to make presents. I'm not making so many Christmas cakes this year (so time consuming and expensive) but I plan to make mincemeat as gifts (along with fudge and biscuits). I have a large supply of (smallish decorative) Christmas boxes to fill instead of hampers this year too.

Based on your SOA I am sure you could clear the smaller CC with 18% interest rate with that back pay and still leave some for a special Christmas.

I bought a frozen turkey crown last year which I cooked for salads and sandwiches (and curry) - and this meant I could do a much smaller, cheaper turkey for Christmas dinner. Nobody noticed the difference. It was after watching a TV challenge of £50 for Christmas dinner. I realised I could make small changes for big benefits.

db2016

im a couple of days behind on the topic of xmas spends and kids clubs spending etc,

BUT, it struck me that, as others you have a lifestyle you wont compromise on, and this worries me.

i fully expected my experiences to be different from many on here, as the class im in seems to be lower, and thats fine with me.
given that historically, and including my childhood and my way of (now doing things, post BR), is "if you dont have the cash either in hand or saved for it, you cant have it!").

for me xmas was and is the standard "british" xmas, lots of food, drink and then a sleep during the post "huge meal" sluggish-ness! and playing a board game or that years "silly game", like the dentist mouth stretcher game from last year, a plastic mouth widener is put in mouth and you have cards and have to say or act out the card, much fun ensues as you get covered in dribble and cant talk coz of the mouth piece, proper belly laughs for £5 max i think it was.

i also worry about the way your kids do lots of activites etc, the cost for one, but i get the benefit they may get from it. but i also think, your lifestyle and the ones they are in as your children, may get passed down to them when they have kids of grow older. eg they will want to maintain the same level as they have been given and they could themselves also find themselves on here in 202x-203x etc.

the comment from someone about "soul searching" made me think, are you keeping a level of "middle class" lifestyle and associated spending, because your keeping up with the life you had as a kid?

i also think you need to swallow some pride and tell people close to you, two fold, you will have a weight off chest, and another reason, if they dont stick by you or support, well then thats a freebie clean up of people you obviously dont really need in your life and a nice by-product of telling them. aka when the S,HitsTheFan you really find out whos there for you, and whos the superficial dross. not to mention i think in your circle there may be a few more who will feel relived to see "we arent the only ones" and you may even find some allies who are in the same boat. which could be good for morale and tips!

i'm sorry if you find my words harsh, but im calling it as i see it.

EssexHebridean

Craft stuff is cheap as chips - for years our niece and nephews have been bought "goody bags" rather than a "big" christmas present - as baby's it's something useful/educational, toddlers get a "we remember loving it from our childhood" favourite toy, but once they hit 4 it's the bags all the way and it's the present that they all talk about, we know this from the BIL/SIL's comments! By your standards I'm sure they probably class as full of tat - we do most of it from Pound shops or "Tiger" which is a fab store for oddments and "different" stuff to what you find elsewhere. Hawkin's Bazaar has also been brilliant in the past. Craft stuff - pens, pencils, crayons, packs of papers, card making bits and bobs for the DN, colouring books when they're smaller - all at £1 a piece maximum. I think the trick is to think about what you get extra value on by buying "posh" - so electronics for example, known brands may well be better. Crays, colouring pencils and colouring books though, are mostly what they are, and the DC's won;t give a doodah whether their activity books cost a fiver or a quid!

One thing I will say - over the years we have seen a LOT of people on here who say that they have found themselves in debt due to overspending to maintain a lifestyle - and something that often comes up from that is that they're basing their lifestyle on what they saw their parents do as they were growing up. In a lot of those cases they find out afterwards that in fact, what they thought was a bought-and-paid-for lifestyle was in fact founded on credit - in one case a few years ago I seem to remember that this came to light after the person concerned lost both parents unexpectedly, and found when going through personal effects the bills and loan/credit paperwork for year upon year of expensive presents etc. It was quite a shock, and I remember that poster commenting that they no longer knew what to believe about their childhood, it had left them questioning everything - all the amazing presents unexpected holidays etc - they found themself thinking "But if I'd not had that they wouldn't have had all the worry about money". Another thing that a lot of folk have said is that having realised how much their folks struggled to buy the big ticket presents or must-have toy that year they've been determined not to create the same illusion of lifestyle for their own family. What I I'm trying to say is - it's not just about the "now" - it's also about the expectations you create going forwards, and that those small people who are just children now, will apply to their own lives as adults. It's natural to want to do the best for your children - of course it is, but a wonderful christmas can be about a LOT more than money - Hidden proves that with what she's said. (And I see the post directly above this - which I'd not seen when I wrote mine - says something broadly similar!)

Treadingonplaymobil

Suffolk_lass wrote: »

Maybe do half and half TOPM - you will manage to reduce your Christmas costs this year, I know you will. I have watched your attitude change a lot over this year. You always start by justifying your old position on here, then we all get uppity about what you are doing "wrong" and then you modify what you planned to reflect a more reasonable position.

I am confident that you can do Christmas for less than £1000 - you are already more open to cheaper stocking fillers I think, and you are looking to make presents. I'm not making so many Christmas cakes this year (so time consuming and expensive) but I plan to make mincemeat as gifts (along with fudge and biscuits). I have a large supply of (smallish decorative) Christmas boxes to fill instead of hampers this year too.

Based on your SOA I am sure you could clear the smaller CC with 18% interest rate with that back pay and still leave some for a special Christmas.

I bought a frozen turkey crown last year which I cooked for salads and sandwiches (and curry) - and this meant I could do a much smaller, cheaper turkey for Christmas dinner. Nobody noticed the difference. It was after watching a TV challenge of £50 for Christmas dinner. I realised I could make small changes for big benefits.

The back pay won't be enough to clear the whole card (I THINK it will be about £750, but it might be less), so it's very much a decision of whether to pay half the card off or use the £750 for Christmas (which with Sept/Oct/Nov/Dec savings would bring us up to my budget total).

I am making no cakes this year - I wildly over-baked last year after a mis-calculation, so I have two very well wrapped fruitcakes in the freezer which I'm hoping will be fine to defrost and ice.

db2016 wrote: »

im a couple of days behind on the topic of xmas spends and kids clubs spending etc,

BUT, it struck me that, as others you have a lifestyle you wont compromise on, and this worries me.

i fully expected my experiences to be different from many on here, as the class im in seems to be lower, and thats fine with me.
given that historically, and including my childhood and my way of (now doing things, post BR), is "if you dont have the cash either in hand or saved for it, you cant have it!").

for me xmas was and is the standard "british" xmas, lots of food, drink and then a sleep during the post "huge meal" sluggish-ness! and playing a board game or that years "silly game", like the dentist mouth stretcher game from last year, a plastic mouth widener is put in mouth and you have cards and have to say or act out the card, much fun ensues as you get covered in dribble and cant talk coz of the mouth piece, proper belly laughs for £5 max i think it was.

i also worry about the way your kids do lots of activites etc, the cost for one, but i get the benefit they may get from it. but i also think, your lifestyle and the ones they are in as your children, may get passed down to them when they have kids of grow older. eg they will want to maintain the same level as they have been given and they could themselves also find themselves on here in 202x-203x etc.

the comment from someone about "soul searching" made me think, are you keeping a level of "middle class" lifestyle and associated spending, because your keeping up with the life you had as a kid?

i also think you need to swallow some pride and tell people close to you, two fold, you will have a weight off chest, and another reason, if they dont stick by you or support, well then thats a freebie clean up of people you obviously dont really need in your life and a nice by-product of telling them. aka when the S,HitsTheFan you really find out whos there for you, and whos the superficial dross. not to mention i think in your circle there may be a few more who will feel relived to see "we arent the only ones" and you may even find some allies who are in the same boat. which could be good for morale and tips!

i'm sorry if you find my words harsh, but im calling it as i see it.

As I've said plenty of time, telling people isn't an option unless it's literally a choice between telling them and losing the roof over our heads. It's non-negotiable to me. I don't feel any additional weight/burden due to people not knowing, all my worry about the debt is solely related to how it affect myself, DH and our DC.

I had a lovely lifestyle as a child (far nicer than the one my DCs have :rotfl: ), but my parents NEVER talked about money when I was young, which I think is why I assumed I could continue to lead that lifestyle when I left home, with no real clue about budgeting or money or anything. DH is similar. I don't intend to do this with my DCs, so they will be brought up knowing how to budget and the realities of financial responsibility.

EssexHebridean wrote: »

Craft stuff is cheap as chips - for years our niece and nephews have been bought "goody bags" rather than a "big" christmas present - as baby's it's something useful/educational, toddlers get a "we remember loving it from our childhood" favourite toy, but once they hit 4 it's the bags all the way and it's the present that they all talk about, we know this from the BIL/SIL's comments! By your standards I'm sure they probably class as full of tat - we do most of it from Pound shops or "Tiger" which is a fab store for oddments and "different" stuff to what you find elsewhere. Hawkin's Bazaar has also been brilliant in the past. Craft stuff - pens, pencils, crayons, packs of papers, card making bits and bobs for the DN, colouring books when they're smaller - all at £1 a piece maximum. I think the trick is to think about what you get extra value on by buying "posh" - so electronics for example, known brands may well be better. Crays, colouring pencils and colouring books though, are mostly what they are, and the DC's won;t give a doodah whether their activity books cost a fiver or a quid!

One thing I will say - over the years we have seen a LOT of people on here who say that they have found themselves in debt due to overspending to maintain a lifestyle - and something that often comes up from that is that they're basing their lifestyle on what they saw their parents do as they were growing up. In a lot of those cases they find out afterwards that in fact, what they thought was a bought-and-paid-for lifestyle was in fact founded on credit - in one case a few years ago I seem to remember that this came to light after the person concerned lost both parents unexpectedly, and found when going through personal effects the bills and loan/credit paperwork for year upon year of expensive presents etc. It was quite a shock, and I remember that poster commenting that they no longer knew what to believe about their childhood, it had left them questioning everything - all the amazing presents unexpected holidays etc - they found themself thinking "But if I'd not had that they wouldn't have had all the worry about money". Another thing that a lot of folk have said is that having realised how much their folks struggled to buy the big ticket presents or must-have toy that year they've been determined not to create the same illusion of lifestyle for their own family. What I I'm trying to say is - it's not just about the "now" - it's also about the expectations you create going forwards, and that those small people who are just children now, will apply to their own lives as adults. It's natural to want to do the best for your children - of course it is, but a wonderful christmas can be about a LOT more than money - Hidden proves that with what she's said.

I know that one of my parents (they are long divorced and remarried) funded a lifestyle on credit to a certain extent, whilst one was very sensible, so no skeletons in their closets. I intend to teach the DCs what we've learned as they get older, but I don't think taking away the things that I feel they deserve in their younger childhood is an appropriate step in that process. If we hadn't accumulated the debt over previous years we'd be more than comfortably able to afford the things we try to provide for them on a budget now (remembering that we would be c.£700pm better off without debt repayments), and I don't see why they should be punished for our previous stupidity.

Treadingonplaymobil

On a more general note, there is a definite feeling among many of my lovely readers that I need to do lots of soul searching and have some epiphany. I feel it's only fair, in the interests of you not all feeling like you're banging your heads against a wall, to point out that's unlikely to happen. I've discussed here before that I don't particularly feel my lightbulb is on, I don't particularly get satisfaction from repaying the debt, I don't even particularly mind being in debt, apart from the fact that it costs us £700pm. BUT I am paying the debt. I am intending to continue to pay it (and see no reason that I shouldn't), and I am intending to be debt free one day, so I can have my £700pm back. For now, that's more than enough for me. I don't really have any deeper levels!

Treadingonplaymobil

Good news - the food shop came to pretty much £80 on the nose, which is perfectly acceptable for a 'stocking up' kind of shop. Hoping to do next week's for <£70.

To do today
1. catch up with the ironing (it'll be nice when this ISN'T on my list for maybe one day). Pretty much done. You can actually sit on the sofa now!
2. make a courgette cake to use up the last of the courgettes! Still not done, due to DH not food shopping until this afternoon (I was missing flour and baking powder).
3. start to plan stockings. A slow start made.
4. stick to working during my working hours, not getting distracted by laundry/cooking/cleaning. Done quite well.
5. check library ebook situation and, if it's working fine, cancel Audible subscription. Not done, due to aforementioned refusal to get distracted.

To do this week
1. Continue to plan Christmas gifts.
2. Plan hyacinth bulbs.
3. Charity shop trawl for stocking fillers and hyacinth planters.
4. Library ebooks

To do this month
1. keep the total spend for the month below £3,500. Currently budgeted at £3,349.
2. work a sensible number of hours, even if it means slower progress on the work and debt front. September was rubbish. This is going well so far.
3. make any homemade Christmas gifts.

Kantankrus_Mare

Whilst admiring your enthusiasm and work ethic, I have to say the posts 1776 and 1777 are a combination of what I have been thinking but not wanting to say out loud since the posts about Christmas have been going on.

Yes.....you are looking at doing things slightly cheaper but you still seem to want the outward appearance of living life like your friends? family? live it.

Your children are relatively young at the moment but as they grow older.........doing Christmas becomes more expensive as do clothes and feeding them.

I know you are looking at more income coming in as the children grow but dont let "keeping up with the joneses" scupper your progress.

I have to say that the clothing from Sainsburys impressed me immensely considering what the other options were! :eek:

I do wish you all the best and hope you keep going in the right direction.