Manager fixing clock card - what to do?

Not_Me_Officer

FutureGirl wrote: »

It is directly affecting the OP as now he won't be getting paid the additional money for when the manager isn't there. (This is how I read it).

^^ This.

I must apologise as it seems my long winded post has given many of you the wrong idea. I wasn't considering reporting it. Let me explain:

A day for us is we will all start at the same time really, early morning & we finish in the evening. Approx a 10 hour day. During quiet times of the year (for example: winter) we may take it in turns during the week to finish early on a given day, so for example i may go in tomorrow, notice it is quiet & then ask if it's ok i finish early that day. So instead of finishing in the evening i would finish at dinnertime - a half day. Tuesday someone else may do the same OR we may all go the full week without asking as we may need the money.

Now when asking for an early finish we may request this is unpaid or use part of our annual leave. It's really irrelevant which we ask for because when the time comes for us to finish at dinnertime we are to 'clock off' as that is what we are paid by. We don't finish, go for a chat, call in at a shop, spend an hour & half doing nothing in particular, clock off & then go home - once we are done we clock off & leave be it unpaid or annual leave. That is the system. There is no getting paid for time you've not been there. Never has been. So if for example you finish at 12:00 you clock off at 12:00 & you're paid until 12:00, you don't leave at 12:00, not clock off, come in the next day & write in 12:30 on your card. You simply don't get paid for when you're not there.

In this case & keeping with those times that's exactly what the manager did. Finished at 12:00, didn't clock off, came in the next day & wrote 12:30.This has happened a few times but it seems only ever when they're finishing before 'time' (or at least that's 99% of it).


As for what happens with taking over his role if he leaves early, basically i then carry out the manager duties. I organise the department as to who does what & when. I prioritise the jobs. Things like that, so when he leaves & someone who usually goes for their dinner break at 12:00 is on a job and providing i'm not busy with something else i'll go to that person & say i'll take over doing what you're doing you go get your break (so that nobody is running late & everyone can get their break as close to their time as possible).

How this affects me is i get an increased rate of pay for when i carry out these duties. So if he finishes at 12:00 i get an increased rate of pay from 12:00. If he finishes at 2:00 then i get an increased rate from 2:00.

Yes it's only a half hour & with the increase i get it's not going to make a dint in my pocket but it's really not the point.
Normally i would contact payroll & say hey on this given day i stepped in from 12:00 & they'd pay me from 12:00. That's what normally happens. They don't know i've seen his card but i have. I'm not going to contact them & say hey i stepped in at 12:00 but i saw the guys card & notice he's written extra because then i'd leave myself open to accusation.

I'm just wondering whether i should do what i usually do & say hey i took over from 12:00 because that is what really happened
OR because i happen to have seen his card & noticed the fact he's filling in incorrect times, should i just take it on the chin & lie and say i took over at 12:30, or just i took over on that date & let them work it out from there.

Again it's not about the amount, it's the principle of it.

getmore4less

Assume you know nothing of what they are claiming they work clock or not.

Just put in your clock for your hours and any cover hours, let others sort it out.

if asked you know nothing you are just reporting what hours you do/cover.

ohreally

Not_Me_Officer wrote: »

Again it's not about the amount, it's the principle of it.

Since the situation has a financial impact, sit down with the guy and put the state of play to him and suggest he be mindful of this the next time he decides disappear leaving you to infill, gently suggest if the situation persists then you may have to approach the appropriate individual for a discussion.

If you feel unable to do this you may need to suck it up for a while.

Not_Me_Officer

ohreally wrote: »

Since the situation has a financial impact, sit down with the guy and put the state of play to him and suggest he be mindful of this the next time he decides disappear leaving you to infill, gently suggest if the situation persists then you may have to approach the appropriate individual for a discussion.

If you feel unable to do this you may need to suck it up for a while.

Yes that's my concern.
I actually get along with the manager however the manager is sort of an i'll do what i want when i want kind of person. I'm the big guy around here type of thing. And he's so far up (well you get where that one is going).

I've learned from the past that if you speak out against management then you'll get shot down, short of management assaulting you in front of witnesses. So these days as far as work goes (tasks) it's just easier to be a yes sir no sir person. However i do have limits - such as when it starts affecting my pocket. We'll only be talking loose change for the amount in question but once again - it's not the point.

So i'll put my time in as usual but this time i expect to be questioned as to why the time i'm providing is different to the time the manager is providing & the follow up question of why am i lying.

Hopefully it doesn't end up too bad.

Masomnia

Not_Me_Officer wrote: »

Yes that's my concern.
I actually get along with the manager however the manager is sort of an i'll do what i want when i want kind of person. I'm the big guy around here type of thing. And he's so far up (well you get where that one is going).

I've learned from the past that if you speak out against management then you'll get shot down, short of management assaulting you in front of witnesses. So these days as far as work goes (tasks) it's just easier to be a yes sir no sir person. However i do have limits - such as when it starts affecting my pocket. We'll only be talking loose change for the amount in question but once again - it's not the point.

So i'll put my time in as usual but this time i expect to be questioned as to why the time i'm providing is different to the time the manager is providing & the follow up question of why am i lying.

Hopefully it doesn't end up too bad.

Is there CCTV they could check? Also computer records might show that you were working at the time you said you were, did you send emails etc? Is there an electronic door pass that might have created a record of you leaving? Sorry I didn't read all your posts so I don't know what the nature of the work is

I agree with the previous comments in regards to putting in the correct time for you. I'd add that you should bear in mind that if you put a false time on the records, even if it is to your detriment you are still lying and creating a false document.

getmore4less

You should work on the basis you don't see the times on the clock card.

If they ask then just tell the truth.

How are you supposed to know what false time to put in unless the manager tells you what times to use to claim cover hours.

paddyrg

Got a camera on your phone? Document, take photos of "forgot to clock out" cards with the time in picture, and again when the bonus time is added to it. But only if you want a fight.

Instead, how about an anonymous note straight to the highest up person in the company saying you're aware that some supervisory staff are abusing the clocking system exactly as you describe. Don't need to name names, and keep it short "they 'forget' to clock out, and doctor it the next day". Company owners don't like to be stolen from, by brown-nosers or anyone, and indeed brown-nosers are an irritation they may be happier without. You could suggest a switch to RFID cards, or fingerprints, with a policy that any missed clock outs carry a penalty so can't be adjusted to a bonus.

But anonymously, and to someone senior who's likely to be on salary and not have any timesheet fiddles.

hcb42

Just log it from 12 Noon and let payroll worry about it. No need to do anything else, you were asked to cover from Noon and that is what you did

bartelbe

hcb42 wrote: »

Just log it from 12 Noon and let payroll worry about it. No need to do anything else, you were asked to cover from Noon and that is what you did

The problem with that is payroll asks manager when he left, he says 12:30 and they then ask the OP why they are claiming for management time they didn't work?

Who do payroll believe? The junior or senior member of staff?

Will this guy fess up or try to put the blame on the OP?

-taff

Not_Me_Officer wrote: »

So i'll put my time in as usual but this time i expect to be questioned as to why the time i'm providing is different to the time the manager is providing & the follow up question of why am i lying.

Hopefully it doesn't end up too bad.

You say you took over at that arranged time as he left at that time. They should be able to put two and two together and see he writes his own clock card for those times. If they can't see that, you can ask why there is a query, as, as far as you're concerned, him saying he's leaving, means you are in charge, and then ask, is there a problem?
|If there is a problem, that they don't believe you, they are welcome to investigate the clock cards, to see that you actually clock in and out on your card using the provided machine. Again, this should make them aware that the machine is not being used, so they should investigate why..