Q - notice by tenants to move

isleofdogs

I have a fixed term 2 years tenancy / lease agreement due to end mid this year. I have read the agreement and could not find what would be the notice period I would have given to landlord at the end of the lease. My question is what is the "normal" period I should give my landlord - eg is it 2 weeks or 2 months? I don't want to tell landlord that my lease expires therefore I leave next week. I want to do the right thing. Thanks for any helpful comments.

kinger101

Ordinarily, if neither of you do anything, you'll enter into a periodic tenancy, which will run month-to-month. This will either be a "contractual" periodic tenancy, or a "statutory" periodic tenancy.

The contractual one occurs where there is provision for this to occur in your contract. One the assumption from your post that you've read the contract and it's silent on this (but read it again to be sure), you'll have a statutory period tenancy.

Details of the notice period for those is available here;

http://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/ending_a_periodic_tenancy

It's not as simple as one month's notice, as normally, the tenancy will not end in the middle of the rental period. So if your rental period ends of the 30th, giving notice on the 2nd of March wouldn't end it on the 2nd April, but the 30th of April (unless you and the LL agree otherwise).

If neither you or your landlord have served notice for the fixed term, you're actually entitled to leave on the last day of your fixed term. We could advise you better if you let us know what your intentions are. I appreciate you want to do the right thing by the landlord, but if an agent is involved, they have a habit of putting their own interests above yours and the landlords. By putting you on another fixed term and asking for renewal fees.

isleofdogs

kinger101 wrote: »

Ordinarily, if neither of you do anything, you'll enter into a periodic tenancy, which will run month-to-month. This will either be a "contractual" periodic tenancy, or a "statutory" periodic tenancy.

The contractual one occurs where there is provision for this to occur in your contract. One the assumption from your post that you've read the contract and it's silent on this (but read it again to be sure), you'll have a statutory period tenancy.

Details of the notice period for those is available here;

http://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/ending_a_periodic_tenancy

It's not as simple as one month's notice, as normally, the tenancy will not end in the middle of the rental period. So if your rental period ends of the 30th, giving notice on the 2nd of March wouldn't end it on the 2nd April, but the 30th of April (unless you and the LL agree otherwise).

If neither you or your landlord have served notice for the fixed term, you're actually entitled to leave on the last day of your fixed term. We could advise you better if you let us know what your intentions are. I appreciate you want to do the right thing by the landlord, but if an agent is involved, they have a habit of putting their own interests above yours and the landlords. By putting you on another fixed term and asking for renewal fees.

Thanks, kinger101, for your reply.

We have been renting this house for more than 3.5 years - by June this year it will be 4 years. We signed an initial 18 months lease, then it was on a month to month tenancy for 6 months, then landlord decided to raise rent and we extended the lease for 2 years at the new rent.

Soon after we signed the extended lease the house next door started their big renovations - and it is still going!!! We asked landlord to break lease more than 6 months ago, but they said renos next door would finish soon (and it is still going on and off).

Landlord has said many times to neighbours near us that we are very good tenants and they do not want to lose us - of course we are the best tenants they have had, we have always paid monthly rent in advance directly to their bank account, hence they have saved between 10% to 15% agents commission (no agent managed their house). And, we keep house and gardens in tidy and good condition - not many tenants will do this.

The house is a bit dated and we want to move into something smaller, more modern and of course cheaper rent. Main problem for us is to find a suitable property where our little dog is allowed. She is extremely clean and well behaved - all neighbours and kids love her. Apartments are out of bounds as most do not allow dogs, so I have to look for houses and not many are for rent in the area where we are. Hence it will take a while for me to look for another property to rent (and I am very fussy as well).

I expect it will take me at least 4 weeks or longer to find another place. I don't want to tell landlord too early as I don't know when I will find a place. My aim is to start looking 2 months before the end of the current fixed lease, and after I find something I will tell landlord.

G_M

You have a fixed term contract. By definition your tenancy therefore has an end date. When that end date comes, the tenancy ends.

So you do not (legally) have to give any notice. You can simply move out on the final day (or indeed earlier, though you still remain liable for rent, utilities, council tax etc till the end date).

Of course, it is polite to give your landlord warnimg of your intention to leave. It is also helpful in terms of the practical arrangements - handing over keys, getting check-out inspection arranged and hence your deposit returned swiftly etc., plus you are more likely to get a good reference if you need one.

Alternatively, you can stay put. The day after the tenancy ends, a new, periodic, tenancy will start automatically.

See:

* Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

isleofdogs

Just want to ask a follow up question on this.

Been corresponding with landlord to tell them we would be moving out before or at the end of our lease expiry - by giving them 4 weeks notice. They said we had to give them 2 months notice (with a definite date) to get agents to market they property. We read the AST again, and there was a tenant only break clause which said we have to provide a minimum 2 months written notice to landlord. Therefore, we decided to give landlord 2 months notice to move out at the expiry date of our lease - because we don't want to have to fight for our deposit (had to do with previous landlord who did not register our deposit with anyone!?)

As soon as we gave notice landlord came with 2 agents to market the property. There were 2 separate viewings from the 2 agents (on a Saturday). Then we had to go overseas to sort out an urgent matter. We did not tell landlord we would be away for 2 weeks, as there would be 6 weeks before our moving date for agents to show potential tenants. While we were away agents and landlord called but our phone was switched off due to expensive roaming charges. I emailed landlord to tell them we were away due to an emergency.

Questions: Is there any legal requirement which stipulates the period which tenants have to make property available for viewings by potential tenants? Where I have lived overseas, the contract said tenants must give 4 weeks notice but agents can only show property to potential tenants 2 weeks before moving date (and this is the law). What is the normal situation in the UK? We have given 2 months notice as noted in our lease agreement, but it is silent that we have to make the property available for viewing during this 2 months notice. I suspect I will have to fight landlord not leaving keys with someone else while we were away.

Thanks again in advance.

00ec25

isleofdogs wrote: »

Just want to ask a follow up question on this.

Been corresponding with landlord to tell them we would be moving out before or at the end of our lease expiry - by giving them 4 weeks notice. They said we had to give them 2 months notice (with a definite date) to get agents to market they property. We read the AST again, and there was a tenant only break clause which said we have to provide a minimum 2 months written notice to landlord. Therefore, we decided to give landlord 2 months notice to move out at the expiry date of our lease - because we don't want to have to fight for our deposit (had to do with previous landlord who did not register our deposit with anyone!?)

As soon as we gave notice landlord came with 2 agents to market the property. There were 2 separate viewings from the 2 agents (on a Saturday). Then we had to go overseas to sort out an urgent matter. We did not tell landlord we would be away for 2 weeks, as there would be 6 weeks before our moving date for agents to show potential tenants. While we were away agents and landlord called but our phone was switched off due to expensive roaming charges. I emailed landlord to tell them we were away due to an emergency.

Questions: Is there any legal requirement which stipulates the period which tenants have to make property available for viewings by potential tenants? Where I have lived overseas, the contract said tenants must give 4 weeks notice but agents can only show property to potential tenants 2 weeks before moving date (and this is the law). What is the normal situation in the UK? We have given 2 months notice as noted in our lease agreement, but it is silent that we have to make the property available for viewing during this 2 months notice. I suspect I will have to fight landlord not leaving keys with someone else while we were away.

Thanks again in advance.

there is no overriding legal "normal" situation regarding notice or access for the purposes of viewing the property.

your contract is silent (unusual as they often do cover such a basic situation) so you do not "have" to allow access for viewing

clearly based on what you have written above your LL has no idea of the actual law and simply does what he wants. If you are sure that the LL does not have keys to the property (have you changed the locks? does your contract say you cannot change them - that also would be a "normal" clause?) then you are within your rights not to give them any and therefore refuse access for viewing because you are not required to do so by your contract and there is no general law that requires it either

isleofdogs

Thanks, 00ec25, for your reply.
There are 2 locks on door. One stuck last year so a neighbor (known to LL - they are from same ethnic background) bought a new lock and replaced it. He did not charged me and said he would get reimbursed from LL. There were 2 keys for new lock. I have both of them. LL never asked for a duplicate.
If I was in the country (overseas for another week) I would allow access - which I did 2 weeks before I left. I always cooperate in order to get my deposit back - unlike when we viewed the property a number of years ago, agent made appointment and we turned up no one answered the door. When we finally came back another time all the doors to all the rooms were closed and we were not allowed to open them! So I just saw the stairs and hall ways plus kitchen!
LL claimed because I was away there were some wanted to view so he potentially lost out on good tenants!
Knowing my rights, I will be able to rebutte LL.

G_M

isleofdogs wrote: »

...... there was a tenant only break clause which said we have to provide a minimum 2 months written notice to landlord.
This is only relevant if you wish to end the tenancy early - ie before the end of the fixed term.
(though as you've not quoted the full text of the Break Clause I cannot comment on any other aspects of it)

Therefore, we decided to give landlord 2 months notice to move out at the expiry date of our lease
Your 'notice' has no legal meaning and no legal force, since the contract will end anyway 'at the expiry date of our lease'.

However it was a kind ad helpful 'heads up' to the landlord.

- because we don't want to have to fight for our deposit (had to do with previous landlord who did not register our deposit with anyone!?)
Read link below.

.....

Questions: Is there any legal requirement which stipulates the period which tenants have to make property available for viewings by potential tenants?
Read your tenancy agreement. I cannot see it.

Where I have lived overseas, the contract said tenants must give 4 weeks notice but agents can only show property to potential tenants 2 weeks before moving date (and this is the law). What is the normal situation in the UK?
Read your tenancy agreement. I cannot see it. The relevant laws in Eng/Wales are:
* what was agreed in the contract
* a tenant's Common Law right to 'quiet enjoyment' ie no unnecessary interference by the LL to their home life

We have given 2 months notice as noted in our lease agreement,
Irrelevant as noted aove

but it is silent that we have to make the property available for viewing during this 2 months notice.
In that case you could choose to refuse all acess by the landlord - but this seems extreme, and unhelpful
I suspect I will have to fight landlord not leaving keys with someone else while we were away.

Thanks again in advance.

The ideal solution is to discuss this with your LL and reach a compromise eg
* you permit access when you are present but not when you are absent (or vice verse if you prefer!)
* you permit access on 1 day per week (or 2, 3 whatever)
* you restrict acess to certain hours eg 6 pm-7pm or after 12 on weekends or whatever

the above is all up for discussion/negotiation.

Does the LL/agent have keys? Are you happy for them to enter in your absence? If not, consider changing the locks. It's your home.

If you cannot reach an amicable agreement with the LL on access, then you can simply refuse all access. Put this in writing, in a letter, to the address provided, and copy the agent. And change the locks. It's a last resort thing to do which I don't recommend, but it's your legal right.

* Deposits: payment, protection and return

isleofdogs

Thanks G_M for your reply.

This is the clause: any time after six months of the initial fixed term of this tenancy ... the tenant may invoke this break clause by providing a minimum of two months written notice to the LL (such notice to expire on the last day of a rental period of the tenancy). At the end of such notice the tenancy shall end and all obligations shall cease, subject nevertheless to any claim by either party against the other in respect of any breach of any of the terms and conditions of the agreement.

I cannot find anything which mentioned that I have to provide access for viewing during the 2 months notice. I think because I am away, LL is bullying me that he has lost potential tenants as agents could not reach me for appointments!

isleofdogs

Sorry I have found that clause which said: during the last 2 months of tenancy, the tenants agree to visits to the property by the LL or the LL's Agent together with any other persons in connection with the re-letting, sale or refurbishment of the property upon a minimum of 24 hours prior verbal or written notification.

So, does this mean the LL can harass me for breaching this clause - no access while I was away - claiming he has lost out on potential tenants? Can he sue me for lost rent?

dimbo61

Most new locks come with 3 keys !