Moving house, timings of actual move?

firely2327

Hi folks

Couldn't find a relevant thread so I apologise if I've missed a relevant one.

Having initially thought of keeping my home in Wales while I move to England, I've now decided to sell. I'm moving for work so it's not like I can put off the move for months and months, though there may be a couple of months wiggle room if really necessary, but it's limited.

I have a deposit for a new place without selling the current but can't in the long term afford to leave the Welsh pad sitting there empty. I'll be putting it on the market soon, once I do some minor cosmetic upgrades. So my questions are these:

1. All going well and I find somewhere suitable to purchase in England and a buyer for the Welsh place (and I apologise in advance for the naive question), I guess that if I'm using the sale in Wales for the purchase then both will have to be completed the same day and I'd have to move that day too?
- ideally in order to give time to clean up in both places and move everything (including animals), I'd like a few days at the bare minimum in order to do the move.

2. If I can't find a buyer for the Welsh pad in time I can hold out a few months with it empty, though not ideal obviously. Would a lender still lend to me without me taking the Welsh pad to a buy to let mortgage, if they know I'm attempting to sell?

3. If I do switch to a buy to let but do so because the lender makes me in order to make it permissible for me to get the English mortgage, how short a tenancy can I offer tenants? I imagine a long tenancy even of 6 months may put off potential purchasers.

Thanks in advance for any pearls (or perils!) of wisdom:)

da_rule

A lender probably won't insist you switch to a buy to let mortgage. However, if you are going to own two properties simultaneously then you will have to include the mortgage and bills on your current property within the affordability calculations.

Becoming a landlord is something to avoid really if you are looking to sell. Just because you give someone a short tenancy doesn't mean they'll leave. You could spend time and money taking things through the court to evict them. And then there's the potential damage that could occur. Also, you'd probably have to pay fees to switch your mortgage, as well as agents fees and landlord insurance, so probably wouldn't be worth it for a short period.

If you complete on both properties (selling your one and buying the new one) on the same day then yes, you will have to be completely out of your old place by the agreed completion time (you will most likely be selling with vacant possession so have no right to stay). If you're not part of a wider chain and can afford to pay a deposit and all the fees in cash then you could in theory complete on the property you are buying before the one you are selling (if you can get a mortgage). You could then complete on the property you're selling a week later etc.

Something to bear in mind is stamp duty. If, at the end of the day on which you buy your new property you own 2 properties then you will pay the higher rate of stamp duty (an extra 3%). If you sell your Welsh place within 36 months then you can claim a refund on the extra 3% paid.

AnotherJoe

firely2327 wrote: »

Hi folks

Couldn't find a relevant thread so I apologise if I've missed a relevant one.

Having initially thought of keeping my home in Wales while I move to England, I've now decided to sell. I'm moving for work so it's not like I can put off the move for months and months, though there may be a couple of months wiggle room if really necessary, but it's limited.

I have a deposit for a new place without selling the current but can't in the long term afford to leave the Welsh pad sitting there empty. I'll be putting it on the market soon, once I do some minor cosmetic upgrades. So my questions are these:

1. All going well and I find somewhere suitable to purchase in England and a buyer for the Welsh place (and I apologise in advance for the naive question), I guess that if I'm using the sale in Wales for the purchase then both will have to be completed the same day and I'd have to move that day too?

That is correct, the only way round it would be to sell the Welsh one first and move into temporary accommodation yourself.

- ideally in order to give time to clean up in both places and move everything (including animals), I'd like a few days at the bare minimum in order to do the move.

You arent going to get that. Can you rehouse the animals elsewhere?

2. If I can't find a buyer for the Welsh pad in time I can hold out a few months with it empty, though not ideal obviously. Would a lender still lend to me without me taking the Welsh pad to a buy to let mortgage, if they know I'm attempting to sell?

Depends on your affordability. Probably a non starter.
Forget BTL that wont help it will complicate.

3. If I do switch to a buy to let but do so because the lender makes me in order to make it permissible for me to get the English mortgage, how short a tenancy can I offer tenants? I imagine a long tenancy even of 6 months may put off potential purchasers.
A lender wont make you do that or even suggest it, and it wont aid with getting a mortgage, so its a moot point.

Thanks in advance for any pearls (or perils!) of wisdom:)

Most people just put up with the annoyance of a chain because the other "solutions" you've come up with, such as BTL, are really non-starters.

Just how difficult is it moving these animals? Is it 20 sheep in a field or a hamster? How will they be looked after if you have an even temporary position of working hundreds of miles away from your house? Can you rehome them for a few days whilst you move?

firely2327

AnotherJoe wrote: »

Just how difficult is it moving these animals? Is it 20 sheep in a field or a hamster? How will they be looked after if you have an even temporary position of working hundreds of miles away from your house? Can you rehome them for a few days whilst you move?

Rehoming really isn't a great option and really a non-starter. The dog would go anywhere but the cats are the problem. One is particularly timid and hides for hours on end after a stranger coming to the house. A cattery would be very traumatic for her and she wouldn't cope with being in a strangers house... nor would the strangers house cope with her or her siblings:)


Why would I be working hundreds of miles away from my house????

AnotherJoe

Because the way you were talking, selling in Wales buying in England and too long to commute but I think I assumed that.

So, in that case can I take it you can commute to your new place of work from where you are now, for an few months, before you sell ?

If so, just sell in a chain, and take the week off work before you move to clean up pack and and then on the day drive the menagerie to the new house.

G_M

firely2327 wrote: »

Hi folks


1. All going well and I find somewhere suitable to purchase in England and a buyer for the Welsh place (and I apologise in advance for the naive question), I guess that if I'm using the sale in Wales for the purchase then both will have to be completed the same day and I'd have to move that day too?
correct
- ideally in order to give time to clean up in both places and move everything (including animals), I'd like a few days at the bare minimum in order to do the move.
then move out of Wales to family/friends either before and/or after Completing the sale for a few days

2. If I can't find a buyer for the Welsh pad in time I can hold out a few months with it empty, though not ideal obviously. Would a lender still lend to me without me taking the Welsh pad to a buy to let mortgage, if they know I'm attempting to sell?
if you are leaving it empty & not letting it, why would any lender require you to have a BTL mortgage?

Do you have a mortgage at present on Wales? If so, then to get a simultaneous mortgage on the new property you'll eed
* enough income to service both mortgages
* enough income to satisfy both running costs (council tax etc etc)
Will your new lender be satisfied you have the income?

3. If I do switch to a buy to let but do so because the lender makes me in order to make it permissible for me to get the English mortgage, how short a tenancy can I offer tenants? I imagine a long tenancy even of 6 months may put off potential purchasers.
you can offer anything from 1 day to 3 years. However the law will not permit you to evict the tenants within 6 months if they choose not to leave.

Frankly the costs, risks, and stress of letting are not worth it for 'a few months'

And I fail to understand why your English mortgage lender would (could) "make [you take out a BTL] in order to make it permissible for me to get the English mortgage". If you pass their affordability criteria, they'll lend, if you don't they won't.

saajan_12

If you don't expect to keep both properties for long, I wouldn't go down the letting route - rent won't be worth the learning, set up costs, repairs and risk in being a new LL. So then there's also no complications with BTL mortgages.

If you fit affordability criteria for a new mortgage on the English place while keeping the Welsh place, you can buy the English place first and complete on selling the Welsh place later giving you overlap to pack / move / clean slowly. Just a few points to consider:
- Note if this lowers your deposit available for the English place and you need to borrow more, you may pay higher interest rates.
- Also, when the Welsh place sells, you may face penalties for using the equity to pay off a chunk of the English mortgage.
- You may initially be liable for higher SDLT on the English place. You can reclaim this when you complete on selling the Welsh place, but that can cause cash flow issues.
- If you buy the English place and then can't sell the Welsh place, how long can you afford to keep both properties? You can mitigate this by agreeing and exchanging on both transactions at the same time, but with different completion dates.

If you don't fit the criteria for 2 mortgages, you'll have to complete in a chain, moving all in one day as usual.

Person_one

You're overthinking, keep it simple. Sell and buy, complete both on the same day, spend the week before completion packing and then get a removal company to take all your stuff to the new house while you drive up with the pets in crates/harnesses/cat carriers in the back of the car.

You'll be knackered by the end of the day but that's just part of moving house!

Your Welsh house will sell if you price it right.

PasturesNew

firely2327 wrote: »

- ideally in order to give time to clean up in both places and move everything (including animals), I'd like a few days at the bare minimum in order to do the move.

Yes, you simultaneously stop owning one and you own the other one, unless you specifically engineer an overlap by staggering it so you (say) exchange on both at the same time (to give you confidence it will be happening), but complete on the purchase a week before you complete on the sale. Having said that, you're also working with the whims/timescales of two other people with their own wish list.

This means your options are:
1] Just do it, just don't unpack at the new address, then work round the boxes.
2] Just do it, splitting your belongings into two piles: one small lot goes into the new house and the rest into self storage and you collect that yourself in the coming weeks.
3] Have all your stuff packed to go into storage for 1-2-3-4 weeks while you book a "holiday caravan" to live in while you sort out the new house.

ThomasChaney

Looking for some moving company you should look for good reviews searching about them. Trusting a moving company is no small thing. You’re putting your belongings entirely in the hands of other people for numerous days. Ensuring that you have peace of mind through the whole process is a major part of any moving company’s job description.

firely2327

Thanks folks, all very good advice really.


It's been a difficult decision but I've decided to keep the Welsh property for the time being. The mortgage on it isn't prohibitively expensive and even if I had to leave it empty I could afford to keep it and a property in England for a while at least (I'm not planning on pushing a mortgage borrowing to anywhere near my limit there). I'm getting a permission to let on the Welsh property from my current lender and there's a good rental market in the area, particularly for individual rooms for non-students (the place is saturated with crappy student rooms). I'll be keeping a room in the house free for my occasional use, so the tenant/s will be semi-lodgers really, seeing me the occasional weekend. I plan to move back to Wales in the future, when circumstances permit, so it seems logical. Having done the math I won't become rich, but it will pay for itself and, unless a negative equity situation arises I should have a small profit each year, even considering the smaller deposit and therefore slightly higher interest rate on the English property. If the interest rates shoot up it'll mean selling in Wales I imagine, unless I get back living here before then


Thanks again for all the advice... and yes, I'm sure some of you think I'm crazy, lol