SmartParking appeal queries

tablemouse

Hi All.

I'm preparing for the first appeal against a parking charge from SmartParking. I've been reading the NEWBIES thread in some detail, I just had a few questions to ask before doing this.

Firstly, why is the advice in the NEWBIES thread so different from that in the "Fight Unfair Private Parking Tickets" main MoneySavingExpert article? The letter template there admits who is the driver and argues about disproportionate fines which I believe are no longer valid defences. I'm assuming I should ignore that information.

From reading the NEWBIE thread I should use the blue text template and sent it on day 26 electronically. Is it worth editing the text to be more specific for my situation, and include photographic evidence?

Specifically, the driver has received a windscreen PCN because they borrowed a car (which they do not own and am not the registered keeper) and may not have transferred over the parking permit that day. The car park in general consists of many smaller company car parks joined by a main road. There are warning signs on the main road and in most of the carparks. These signs are reasonably clear.

The specific carpark the driver used did not have any signage on the small road leading up to it, or at the entrance or in the carpark itself. This is because the carpark has only recently been incorporated into the management system. The driver has photographic evidence of the lack of signs. There was an A4 laminated document warning about a "fine" near the (pin code accessed) barrier, but this was printed by a third party (a company that has permission to use the carpark) who is in no way affiliated with the parking management company or the land owner. This applicable section of the notice states "You may receive a parking fine if you do not display a valid permit." Furthermore, the route the driver took out of the carpark to their destination does not have any easily visible signs as it cuts across various verges and paths.

Should I be mentioning any of this in my initial appeal on the drivers behaf? (Assuming any of it is relevant). I will of cause not provide any details of who the driver was.

Apologies for asking questions that are probably trivial - I've read lots of threads and used the search but I don't believe any cover these points specifically.

I'm also not sure as to how much detail or what photos I should post here considering this is an open forum...

Thanks for the help.

Redx

you would have to ask the admin staff at MSE why their "guide" is so woeful and pitiful , its been discussed to death on here and we all feel contempt for their inept and incorrect advice , hence why the NEWBIES sticky thread is here and should be followed

that thread is been here for the last 4 years and has been honed and adapted many times to the ever changing world of private parking and appeals (especially with changing laws and with the BEAVIS case too)

any defence of your "case" is done at the POPLA stage , later on , you dont show your hand in poker prematurely , so the same applies here

the script in that thread is tried and tested and been used thousands of times already , why break up a winning hand ?

SMART wont capitulate at the beginning because there is no profit in upholding your appeal, so these companies almost always reject any appeal completely

the signs etc have to have planning consent and also comply with the BPA CoP , they rarely do , so its what the CoP says about them , not what you "think" about them

if its complicated as you say , then clearly it needs a redesign , which is not your problem

so use the blue text template and be like a sheep following the pack leader , then take your legal arguments and photos to popla in your appeal

then watch SMART fold when they see a decent popla appeal (they almost always do)

pogofish

The MSE parking tickets guide is a load of rubbish. The Newbies Sticky is however about the most well-researched and up to date guides you could hope to find.

The rest is irrelevant - what actually happened means next to nothing to a PPC as all they want is your money. The proven points and approaches in the Newbies Sticky are your best hope. Poor signage is something you can use to your advantage though.

You are right to be careful about what you post here. PPCs do trawl this forum looking to catch people out.

tablemouse

Thank you both for the information and update.

I will follow your advice and appeal on day 26 with an exact copy of the blue text with the relevant details filled out.

I will also study the guide and the relevant regs (BPA CoP) and write the POPLA appeal. I'll submit a draft of this here first.

Does the driver need to be able to prove the time at which any photographic evidence was taken? They are struggling to find an option for this on their phone!

Thanks again for the help. The driver is somewhat livid for being fined for using a carpark which they have a permit for so I will fight this tooth an nail on their behalf.

Redx

its an INVOICE , not a fine" , so a speculative invoice for alleged rule breaking , nothing more

neither SMART PARKING nor any other PPC can "FINE" you , me OR the QUEEN either !!!

if you can turn on time and date on your picture , then do so , but the EXIF meta data embedded in the digital photo tells when it was taken plus other information

tablemouse

Thanks again for the help. I really appreciate that you are both spending your time in order to help me.

The driver is attempting to talk to the land owner to try and get the charge overturned. If they reveal their identity to the owner is there a chance that the PPC might find out the drivers details due to being contacted by the owner? (For example phoning them to ask for details and revealing identifiable information?) I'm assuming data protection laws should prevent this and that the PPC would have to provide evidence as to how they obtained the drivers details...

Should that route be unsuccessful, (which is likely) I will appeal the charge on the drivers behalf and post an update on the POPLA appeal status.

tablemouse

Smart Parking backed down at the first stage. I used the template letter and added once sentence to say that the driver reported that there are no signs visible at the entrance or in the carpark itself. Thanks for the help all!

Thank you for your recent communication.

I have noted the points you raised and would like to confirm that we are cancelling the Parking Charge Notice.

If I can be of any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact me.


Yours sincerely,

Smart Parking Ltd

Coupon-mad

Jolly good! Stuff 'em!

If I can be of any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact me.

Wonder how they think they can 'assist'?!