Not your usual PCN, Excel Parking

Coupon-mad

Trepidgiraffe wrote: »

DVLA replied to the complaint email.

They state :

"Having reviewed the situation, I should firstly mention that the correspondence placed on the vehicle at the time in question is not a NTD, Excel Parking Services have introduced a process where instead of affixing a notice to driver on the vehicle, they place a notice to make the motorist aware the terms and conditions of parking may have been breached and an official notice will be issued via the postal system. Where a notice is not affixed to a vehicle, for the keeper liability provisions of PoFA to be utilised, a notice must then be delivered within 14 days of the event.

There is currently no requirement from DVLA that a notice to driver must be placed on the vehicle at the scene. Therefore any request for the keeper details may be submitted immediately"


They claim its an NTD, which is at odds with what PoFA states and NTD should look like, and then claim PoFA has been followed correctly in Excel sending a NTK within 14 days.

Comments ?

Reply and ask where the DVLA is drawing the line and on what basis are they supposing this Notice is ''not a NTD''?

When is a NTD not a NTD? When it's a fake one?

Trepidgiraffe

I asked DVLA how they formed the opinion that they consider the NTD, not an NTD, below is their reply.

DVLA has been advised by the International Parking Community (IPC), that these notices are not Notice to Drivers. These notices have been introduced to make the driver aware that a breach of parking conditions may have occurred and that a notice will be issued in the post. This notice also provides the ability for this to be appealed.

The notice itself does not make any reference to a fee needing to be paid. If the driver (upon receipt of this notice) views the website, they will be provided an option to appeal or pay but they are not obliged to do so. If however neither of these options is taken by the driver, the parking company may then issue a notice to the keeper via the postal system. If the driver does appeal or pay this charge, the parking company would then have no need to request the vehicle keeper details from DVLA.

As previously mentioned, if there are any concerns with this process, the driver or keeper can raise this with the IPC.



They appears DVLA don't have a line when determining what is an NTD or not, they just get told what to think by the IPC.

Any advice on how to progress would be helpful.

Coupon-mad

DVLA has been advised by the International Parking Community (IPC), that these notices are not Notice to Drivers.

I am sorry - WHAT????? David Dunford has swallowed THAT??

If the driver (upon receipt of this notice) views the website, they will be provided an option to appeal or pay but they are not obliged to do so. If however neither of these options is taken by the driver, the parking company may then issue a notice to the keeper via the postal system. If the driver does appeal or pay this charge, the parking company would then have no need to request the vehicle keeper details from DVLA.

Quote the above - their own words - back at the DVLA and ask them, right, what's the difference then? How is a consumer supposed to know, and what you have described is EXACTLY the same as any NTD situation. Ask to escalate the complaint within the DVLA because this isn't good enough, of course this is a Notice to Driver.

How bl00dy dare they say 'the IPC told us it isn't' - I would remind them that this smacks of when Mr Duff used to tell the DVLA that Proserve 'is not a parking company'. Tell them this is not going away, very clearly they are having the wool pulled over their eyes and they are failing in their duty to protect keepers' data, which CANNOT be released within 28 days of an on-screen NTD. This is very clearly an on screen NTD, based upon their own description!

Trepidgiraffe

Many apologies. I have been kept away from this matter for personal reasons.

Thank You Coupon-mad. I shall wake the sleeping beast that this is and escalate it.

So far, there have been 2 letters from the PPC with offers of a reduced payment.

I will update with the DVLA escalation reply.

Umkomaas

I think a lot of water has flowed under the bridge since Coupon's advice back in February. Still, another prod in DD's back might draw out what the DVLA's current position is on this.

Coupon-mad

Email David Dunford back and tell him it's in the public domain that Excel are describing these as 'charge notices' and misleadingly saying that the POFA applies, even when no NTK followed, at all:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/72991520#Comment_72991520

Send a pm to jam1991 first, and maybe get together to make your escalated complaints to the DVLA.

Your case shows hat the IPC have pulled the wool over the DVLA's eyes about the 'fake PCNs' in this case, saying in your case that it's not a NTD, then trying to rely upon it anyway and calling it a 'charge notice' in his/her case. Get together and send your joint evidence to Mr Dunford.

steviebuk

I've been in a Waitrose recently controlled by Britannia. I've not been fined but was curious about their really poor sign.


https://pasteboard.co/HNmwuIj.jpg


It's not in a lit area and impossible to read the small print before parked in the car park. There is no mention of the "parking contract" on the sign and the link to their website that they give, also has no indication of this "parking contract".


The sign doesn't even state you have to use Waitrose, so you can essentially use the Waitrose car park for 2 hours and never set foot in their store.



Their site itself is a breach of GPDR because it admits it uses and saves cookies but gives no option to reject those cookies.


Having parked in their carpark recently, I'm tempted to do a SAR request or a right to erasure request to ask them to remove my number plate from their system.

The_Deep

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week, hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem has become so widespread that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. It has even been suggested that some of these companies have links with organised crime.

Watch the video of the Second Reading and committee stage in the House of Commons recently. MPs have a very low opinion of this industry.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2018-07-19/debates/2b90805c-bff8-4707-8bdc-b0bfae5a7ad5/Parking(CodeOfPractice)Bill(FirstSitting)

and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by in the not too distant future..

steviebuk

This is the ball their GPDR department has come back with.

On the sign they say they aren't responsible for damage or break ins to cars blah blah. But now claim they can save your numberplate for 3 months, even if you haven't been issued with a notice because their section 2.1.8 which states

2.1.8. the prevention and detection of crime

Which contradicts their sign. So they are, against GDPR retaining numberplates for no reason.

Our Privacy Policy is available on our website, I think you was looking at our online Privacy Policy, which is also why it refers to Cookies. Cookies are not used with ANPR cameras.



If you follow the link - https://www.britannia-parking.co.uk/Content/Policy



Select Click here and it will load a PDF of our Company’s Privacy Policy. However I have attached a copy.



As you have not been issued with a Parking Charge Notice we will not be making any requests to the DVLA to obtain your personal data. I have searched the camera log and I can only find a recording of your vehicle exiting the car park. This recording will be logged for 3 months then automatically removed, under the legal bases of section 2.1.8 of our Privacy Policy.

Fruitcake

steviebuk wrote: »

I've been in a Waitrose recently controlled by Britannia. I've not been fined but was curious about their really poor sign.


https://pasteboard.co/HNmwuIj.jpg


It's not in a lit area and impossible to read the small print before parked in the car park. There is no mention of the "parking contract" on the sign and the link to their website that they give, also has no indication of this "parking contract".


The sign doesn't even state you have to use Waitrose, so you can essentially use the Waitrose car park for 2 hours and never set foot in their store.



Their site itself is a breach of GPDR because it admits it uses and saves cookies but gives no option to reject those cookies.


Having parked in their carpark recently, I'm tempted to do a SAR request or a right to erasure request to ask them to remove my number plate from their system.

Why have you posted on someone else's thread that is over a year old about a completely different site and completely different PPC?