We’d like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum.
This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are – or become – political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!
The Forum now has a brand new text editor, adding a bunch of handy features to use when creating posts. Read more in our how-to guide
Possible will fraud.
desperate_from_derby
Posts: 4 Newbie
In 2011 my Aunt and Uncle made joint wills using a specialist in Wills and Probate recommended to them by Help The Aged.
I, along with one of my uncles niece, were made executors and also given Lasting Power of Attourney for both of them. I saw my relatives weekly for many years, the other niece from my Uncles side saw them maybe once every couple of years and lives a fair distance away.
They wrote joint wills. A long with myself a close neighbour was also witness. They paid quiet a bit to make sure every eventuality was covered.
I, my sister and 3 nieces from my uncles side were to benefit on the death of the last survivor. Who ever died first left 100% of any house sale, bank accounts etc to their partner. Nothing was to be left to anyone else until both had died.
In 2012 my Uncle was diagnosed with terminal bowel cancer and underwent surgery. I sat with his his wife everyday in the ICU and he underwent major surgery. His wife who had not been diagnosed with early dementia, but everyone suspected, took a turn for the worse and focused all her anger and frustration on me her closest relative. I phoned another neice of my Uncles and asked her to visit him in hospital and calm my Aunt. She stayed 3 hours and left. Then phoned me 3 days later to tell me I was never to see them again at my Aunts request. I tried so many times, but was told they were too ill and my being there would make things worse as my Aunt was findingbthings really difficult. I gradually stopped trying as I went through surgery myself and then divorce.
In January 2013 my Uncle died. Unbeknown to me, until last week, the will had been rewritten in the year I hadn't seen them. Leaving 50% of the estate to my uncles 5 nieces. Only 50% went to my Aunt who was moved for a short while into council bungalow accomodation, before moving into a care home with dementia. All her belongings, house contents etc, were taken to Scotland by the uncles niece with the LPA, as soon as the house was sold, she had almost nothing when moving into the bungalow. All the beneficiaries, witness's and executors are from my uncles side of the family.
I have just been told my aunt died last week. She has nothing left, having paid care home fees. Distant relatives have dealt with the funeral arrangements etc, already.
The second will seems to be a DIY one, effecting my Uncle only, not joint and since 'inheriting' 50% of the house sale (£60k) etc they have never seen my Aunt.
My question is as the Lasting Power of Attourney was never revoked, should I have been contacted before any new will was written or anything regarding both my Aunt and Uncles finances was decided. At the very least I thought I would have been told of any changes in their health.
I have ordered copies of the second will which was filed with probate and I have requested a copy of the original will which is still held with the solicitor, with the view to taking things further. I am not looking for anything from the estate. I just think there may have been some injustice and possible will fraud.
Any advice would be welcome.
I, along with one of my uncles niece, were made executors and also given Lasting Power of Attourney for both of them. I saw my relatives weekly for many years, the other niece from my Uncles side saw them maybe once every couple of years and lives a fair distance away.
They wrote joint wills. A long with myself a close neighbour was also witness. They paid quiet a bit to make sure every eventuality was covered.
I, my sister and 3 nieces from my uncles side were to benefit on the death of the last survivor. Who ever died first left 100% of any house sale, bank accounts etc to their partner. Nothing was to be left to anyone else until both had died.
In 2012 my Uncle was diagnosed with terminal bowel cancer and underwent surgery. I sat with his his wife everyday in the ICU and he underwent major surgery. His wife who had not been diagnosed with early dementia, but everyone suspected, took a turn for the worse and focused all her anger and frustration on me her closest relative. I phoned another neice of my Uncles and asked her to visit him in hospital and calm my Aunt. She stayed 3 hours and left. Then phoned me 3 days later to tell me I was never to see them again at my Aunts request. I tried so many times, but was told they were too ill and my being there would make things worse as my Aunt was findingbthings really difficult. I gradually stopped trying as I went through surgery myself and then divorce.
In January 2013 my Uncle died. Unbeknown to me, until last week, the will had been rewritten in the year I hadn't seen them. Leaving 50% of the estate to my uncles 5 nieces. Only 50% went to my Aunt who was moved for a short while into council bungalow accomodation, before moving into a care home with dementia. All her belongings, house contents etc, were taken to Scotland by the uncles niece with the LPA, as soon as the house was sold, she had almost nothing when moving into the bungalow. All the beneficiaries, witness's and executors are from my uncles side of the family.
I have just been told my aunt died last week. She has nothing left, having paid care home fees. Distant relatives have dealt with the funeral arrangements etc, already.
The second will seems to be a DIY one, effecting my Uncle only, not joint and since 'inheriting' 50% of the house sale (£60k) etc they have never seen my Aunt.
My question is as the Lasting Power of Attourney was never revoked, should I have been contacted before any new will was written or anything regarding both my Aunt and Uncles finances was decided. At the very least I thought I would have been told of any changes in their health.
I have ordered copies of the second will which was filed with probate and I have requested a copy of the original will which is still held with the solicitor, with the view to taking things further. I am not looking for anything from the estate. I just think there may have been some injustice and possible will fraud.
Any advice would be welcome.
0
Comments
-
"My question is as the Lasting Power of Attourney was never revoked, should I have been contacted before any new will was written"
Powers of Attorney are usually not relevant to wills: you cannot use a power of attorney to view, modify, make or execute a will on behalf of the donor. Although not relevant to you, it is worth pointing out that it can get more complex if you hold a power of attorney for someone who is an executor of a third party's will, but in general an attorney cannot act in that case either; they would need specialist legal advice in the unusual circumstances where they can.
"At the very least I thought I would have been told of any changes in their health."
It would depend on the precise terms of the LPA. If it were a "joint and several" LPA, as most are, then I don't think that one attorney is under any obligation to communicate with the other. Normally they would, but in the case of family rifts, if one attorney takes a J&S LPA and uses it without telling the other then that is of itself legal. They are still obliged to act in the donor's best interests, of course, but challenging that post mortem would be both difficult and with an uncertain outcome.
It is not as simple as "if you lack capacity such that an LPA is in use, you lack capacity to draw up a will", and showing that the will is invalid would require you to show that they lacked capacity at the point (on the day) that the will was drawn up. However, a DIY will would be easier to challenge as presumably there was not a solicitor or doctor present at any point; they would usually be regarded as confirming the capability of the testator to make the will.
It's not quite clear from your posting if there is actually any money. You say that the new will leaves 50% of the proceeds of the sale to your uncle's family, but that your aunt died with nothing left having spent it all on care home fees. If that is the case, then the will may or may not be valid, but if there are no assets, is it worth pursuing?
If the suggestion is that the uncle's family siphoned money out of your aunt's affairs prior to her death then that is a very serious allegation, but sadly one which it would be difficult now to pursue and in any event the money (and evidence) is probably gone. You could make a complaint to the office of the public guardian about misuse of the LPA and demand that accounts be produced, and in fact I suspect (you would need legal advice) you could demand as an attorney that the other attorney produces accounts directly to you. But quite what you would do with those accounts, even if they showed evidence of fraud, is sadly unclear.
Oh, and it's worth adding that although there are exotic legal instruments for which this is not true, most "mirror wills" do not (and it is sensible that they should not) constrain the ability of the survivor to write a fresh will after the first death. The way around that for people that want to go down that route is an arrangement of trusts so that the survivor does not inherit absolutely but rather inherits an interest in a trust of the deceased's assets. There's a tread currently running in this forum about how that can go wrong in the hands of the naive, and in the circumstances you outline one can easily imagine that a trust would not actually have provided much protection against what you suspect happened.0 -
desperate_from_derby wrote: »
They wrote joint wills. A long with myself a close neighbour was also witness. They paid quiet a bit to make sure every eventuality was covered.
If you were a witness to the first will, then I don't think you would have been able to inherit from it anyway.0 -
I am not looking for any possible inheritance at all. The sole purpose of me being on there as executor, in the first place was to protect my Aunts interests.
My uncle knew he was dying (family history of bowel cancer) and my Aunt was showing signs of dementia for a while. I was effectively blocked from contacting her once my uncle became terminal and the will was changed. My worry is she did not recieve everything he wanted her to have when he died. They worked together for 50 years, why would he in his last year sign it over to distant relatives, leaving his ill wife vunerable. I suppose I will have to take legal advice when the wills and death certificates arrive. I don't care if any monies due get eaten up in legal fees tbh.0 -
Perhaps your uncle wanted to leave some of his money to his nieces rather than risk the whole amount being eaten up by care fees.
Admittedly, that doesn't explain why your sister was cut out of the Will. (You'd already cut yourself out by witnessing it.)0
This discussion has been closed.
Confirm your email address to Create Threads and Reply
Categories
- All Categories
- 353.7K Banking & Borrowing
- 254.2K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 455.1K Spending & Discounts
- 246.7K Work, Benefits & Business
- 603.2K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 178.2K Life & Family
- 260.8K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 16K Discuss & Feedback
- 37.7K Read-Only Boards
