Euro Car Parks Notice to Keeper Letter Advice Please

DrBob_2

Hello Been looking through this part of the forum related to Parking Issues. Received recently a Parking Charge Notice for a daytime occasion on 14th November2016. I am the registered keeper of the car involved.
Photos of the PCN here in this post. I have cleaned up the letter to remove the case sensitive data. Cant get pics in Getting message


(Sorry as a new user you are not allowed to post with links. This is done to stop spammers clogging up the site. Please edit your message below to continue.).......?????


Dont want ECP to identify any of this content .
I have read the Newbies sticky and some of the drafts/final submissions for the POPLA appeals.
As the registered keeper, I have prepared a draft of the appeal letter to the Parking Company Euro Car Parks ready to send (to get a POPLAR number as they will likely reject the appeal letter). The appeal letter to ECP uses the blue text template in the Newbies sticky, but I need a check that it is good to go, as it seems that as cases come up the letter template may need to be adjusted to cater for changes in content of the parking companies NTKs and also what POPLAR panel and legal cases require to win.
Is the blue text still OK for my case ?
The alleged parking breach occurred in a retail car park managed by ECP for a landowner. The car park is free for 90 minutes and the driver over stayed 11 minutes, according to the ANPR cameras. NTK was sent by post and received 26th November 2016. The NTK letter is dated 24th November 2016.
In preparing for the next step the POPLAR submission, I can see points to address
NTK to registered keeper compliant with POFA Para 9 schedule 4. To my uneducated eye the letter appears compliant ? Any bits to challenge ?
NTK to registered keeper compliant with BPA Code ???
Signage requirements compliant with BPA Code and content/wording
ANPR/photographic evidence. Timestamps ?
Grace Periods not applied ?
ECP standing or authority to issue charges on the car park ?
Any others points ?? I have searched Euro Car Parks POPLAR appeals and have gathered some info and will start to put a POPLAR appeal together. I need to go to the car park tomorrow to gather photos of the signage and where the cameras are located.
[FONT=&quot]I need some advice to guide me, any pointers gratefully received. Thks DrBob[/FONT]

Redx

firstly , its POPLA (no R) - ie:- its not the tree !

clearly they have failed clause #13 on grace periods

few if any private signs comply with the CoP , so I doubt an ECP sign complies, the only ones I know of that comply are the Chelmsford ones in the Beavis case

for all we know those signs may have no planning permission or advertising consent either

yes use the BPA blue text template and add an extra line stating that the BPA CoP clause #13 Grace Periods have not been applied and will be a major appeal point in any future appeals or court cases

if you did want to add pics etc you need to use a hosting site like tinypic or photobucket and adding a dead url link , changing http to hxxp before submission (this detail has been posted thousands of times on this forum , put tinypic in the forum search box to see why)

DrBob_2

Thanks for the help re the pics of the letter, modified links below


[IMG]hxxp://i66.tinypic.com/fdu97r.jpg[/IMG]backpage
[IMG]hxxp://i65.tinypic.com/30clnra.jpg[/IMG]frontpage

Hope this works this time

Rgds DrBob

Redx

backpage http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=fdu97r&s=9#.WERPkVyYVOY

frontpage http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=30clnra&s=9#.WERPwlyYVOY

Fruitcake

The NTK does not meet the requirements of the POFA 2012.

Schedule 4 of the POFA does not mention 29 days. The wording in the NTK differs from the exact and precise wording of the POFA schedule. Since the very strict requirements of the POFA wording have not been met, liability cannot be transferred to the keeper.

Additional arbitrary payments (handling charges) are prohibit by the POFA, and I believe may be a breach of the BPA CoP as well.

Coupon-mad

Is the blue text still OK for my case ?

Yes because it suits all cases, it's purely to get a POPLA code.

I think that PCN is OK for compliance and so will POPLA. ECP have improved it in the past couple of months and 29 days is the same as the effect of the wording in the Act 'after the period of 28 days'. That IS 29 days.

At POPLA stage, just prepare the usual kitchen sink appeal, using the templates in post #3 of the NEWBIES thread, plus a first point about grace periods under the BPA CoP, which allow a MINIMUM of ten minutes, not a maximum. You could also add in Kelvin Reynolds of the BPA's words, which Carthesis found the other day. He makes it clear in his final line that as well as allowing a reasonable 'observation period' to read signs and decide whether to leave, there must be additional time to actually then leave (of course!).

ECP normally throw in the towel at POPLA stage as long as there is lots in there; it seems it is not worth their time contesting forum POPLA appeals.

DrBob_2

Thanks for the advice, without your help it is a bit like walking in the dark, not sure what will bump into next.
I'll add the comment about grace periods suggested to the blue text and email to ECP. That should get the POPLA number.
Will post again in a week or so. Will take pics of signs and layout at car park.
Thks once again. DrBob.

Coupon-mad

Have a look at a winning ECP POPLA appeal, these are fun and ECP do not like a long appeal:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5553258

HTH

DrBob_2

Ok thks Coupon Mad for the link, will read it through.
Sent the blue text letter to ECP and they have received & acknowledged, so POPLA prep next for me.
Took pics at the Car Park, for camera placement and sign positions. Will look through these and comment back.
Thks once again for helping.

DrBob_2

Update on events, after submitting the blue letter template and addition of words about ECP not applying BPA CoP regarding Grace Periods, I received letter rejecting appeal and giving a POPLA number.

I have put together a document for submission to POPLA, is it possible someone can scan to see if it will do ? It is approx 7 pages. I can post what is the best way ?

Also following an earlier comment, I have checked re Planning Permission and found ECP submission for ANPR cameras on poles, which was granted PP in 2011. The wrinkle is that the current placement of the entry cameras/pole is some 10m+ away from the position that was granted PP in the 2011 planning application. I spoke with the planning lady at the council office and there is no apparent revision to the 2011 application.
Are ECP in violation of the Town & Country Planning Act ?
Is it a point to be raised ?
If they were in violation, they would likely just apply fro retrospective planning approval, not sure if this is an issue to pursue. ??
Thanks DrBob.

Quentin

Copy and paste it after making sure it's anonymous