UKPC charge for "owner/driver left site"

ElsieCarlisle

Writing about a £60/£100 charge for parking in Maralan/Staples carpark in Carlisle with "owner/driver left site" given as the reason. The ticket was posted on the windscreen and was placed within minutes of arriving leading to the conclusion that an attendant was watching and waiting to pounce although they were not seen. Matalan customer care were of little help and simply advised appealing with UKPC direct. Are UKPC required to provide proof that the driver left the site? The only pictures on their site are of the vehicle taken from different angles with the ticket posted on the windscreen. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Quentin

It's important never to reveal who was driving.


You need to edit your OP and change everywhere you have revealed this.


After you have sorted this then move on to reading up the newbies faq thread to learn how to set about this.

System

UKPC have some signs which do not have the "no leaving" term on and newer ones which do. The newer ones have the term highlighted in yellow.

Can you get pics of the signs at the site?

ElsieCarlisle

Good advice, thank you.

StaffsSW

Is mitigation of their loss still a valid point to raise?

Also look at VCS v Ronald Ibbotson - covers a very similar scenario - http://nebula.wsimg.com/e3da92cb966c72de63ec1f98605c2954?AccessKeyId=4CB8F2392A09CF228A46&disposition=0&alloworigin=1

System

Is mitigation of their loss still a valid point to raise?

Better to look at it in a different way which is how much effort was there in drawing drivers attention to the terms. The best way to mitigate is to inform. If they don't inform, there is a likelihood there is no contract so if the guy is standing there and not tried "mitigating" by informing, then there is a case.

The_Slithy_Tove

ElsieCarlisle wrote: »

Are UKPC required to provide proof that the driver left the site?.

If it went to court, and you denied that the "driver/owner" left the site, then they would have to provide some sort of evidence, e.g. a witness statement from the employee who issued the ticket. Since that would be a long way off, and the UKPC goon probably made no contemporaneous notes, then it's likely that any such witness statement wouldn't be up to much.

Also, what do the signs say about exactly WHO is not allowed to leave the site? Is it the "driver/owner" or some other party? That's important, as is how "site" is defined. I bet it isn't which begs the question of where are the boundaries of this alleged "site" and how is it drawn to the attention of the person leaving.

Now you can see why these type of cases so rarely end up in court. It's a complete minefield for the PPC, with VCS v Ibbotson also hanging in the background.

ElsieCarlisle

Thanks for all the advice and for pointing out the advice on the newbies page. It seems that the way to go is to appeal the charge on day 26 using the UKPC website. Given that the ticket was issued within minutes of the driver arriving it seems as though there was no attempt by the attendant to mitigate loss. Should this be raised in the initial appeal or should this be raised at POPLA appeal stage?

ElsieCarlisle

Will need to go and check the exact wording of the sign. Thanks for suggesting it.

Umkomaas

ElsieCarlisle wrote: »

Thanks for all the advice and for pointing out the advice on the newbies page. It seems that the way to go is to appeal the charge on day 26 using the UKPC website. Given that the ticket was issued within minutes of the driver arriving it seems as though there was no attempt by the attendant to mitigate loss. Should this be raised in the initial appeal or should this be raised at POPLA appeal stage?

Raising this at the initial appeal stage won't change the outcome; it will be rejected. Keep your powder dry for POPLA.

ElsieCarlisle

Ok. So initial response will just be that the driver contests the charge and was a genuine customer of the retail park that day. Once POPLA number has been given, the response will be more detailed and will use advice on wording from the site. Think day 26 may be Christmas Day!